'other' struts in MY front, EJ etc

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 10:03 pm

OK, only a few would be privvy to this detail...

let me start by saying that on MY (gen2 etc) the front strut top mount is to be mounted one way for 4WD and the other way for FWD

With 4WD the centre of the strut is more rearward in the elongated round hole in the strut tower. FWD get the bushing towards the front of the elongated hole in the tower.

Right, when you guys fit up EJ struts and strut tops when installing the x b r e a d kits or your own combinations - just where do you determine the centre line of the new strut is to go ? Forwards, more rearwards, central ? or just where ever it fits ??

I am part way through installing L Series struts and strut mount with the three studs and bearing to replace the two stud bushed strut tops and shagged MY struts. It all started because L struts won't just easily fit to MY strut tops, MY shagged, have decent L Series bits.

Was going to use rear most MY mounting hole and make two new holes for front pair, BUT, that ain't on, the mount is angled and needs to go the same way as an L tower - so will easier adapt to using front hole of MY. This places the bearing/mount/strut centre where FWD strut centres are supposed to be, not 4WD centres.

It might actually be better for a tarmac warrior than a track warrior

in this forward position.

Anyone understand what I am planning on doing, just unknowing what the consequences are or either position. Just don't wanna be drilling holes all over my towers

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 10:20 pm

steptoe wrote:Was going to use rear most MY mounting hole and make two new holes for front pair, BUT, that ain't on, the mount is angled and needs to go the same way as an L towe

Which mount are we talking about here being angled?

Anywhoo, when I wanted L series struts in my wagon I made front lift blocks to have 3 holes on the bottom and 2 studs up top (as you already know) But also built in the rearward and sideways offset into the blocks as well. So I had a top plate in the elongated shape of the MY strut top with 2 studs. I then welded my 2 inches of pipe underneath in the rearward position for 4WD models (carefully measured and checked) then welded the 3 hole L series shaped lower plate with the sideways offset built in (towards engine) and it all worked out fine so far. The front or rear position of the original struts would only alter the caster angle I assume? So I would mod and mount the new struts in the rearward position too.

You sure you cant use the rearmost hole in the MY strut tower?

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:58 am

both the MY strut mount that bolts to the strut tower with two M10's one each end, and the L Series tri bolt M8 strut mount. When you look at them out of car, side on tthe angle can be seen, I am not going for any lift or attention it may bring.

The reason the rear hole in MY tower can't be used is that is is a single hole and the mounts are designed to be two studs at rear - in an L Series.

Mount the mount most rearward and the single hole at front is too far away from remaining stud of the L mount.

I too would prefer to have same centre of stut shaft but not looking that way without too much modifying, which is why I thought better check up on what others did for when EJ suspension goes in MY with the conversion kits.

Have found a usmb member remembers just using front hole as the fitting guide point

hmm, sideways off-set ? Much looking at the tri stud L mount, looks like it had to go one way only in the L's, and maybe people got things wrong on installs if not marked ? The fatter part of the wedge in the design looks to be between two studs so looks it is across the back with wedgeing down to single stud at the front.

I noticed a very small Bridgestone B logo in my old rugged L strut mount sample

Uh oh ! Sam, don't tell me you just shoved the L Series tri stud strut mount on any old how ? Surely not ? No, because you refer to sideways mount ????

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:16 am

steptoe wrote: Uh oh ! Sam, don't tell me you just shoved the L Series tri stud strut mount on any old how ? Surely not ? No, because you refer to sideways mount ????

On my struts I looked them over, spun the top around, all looked the same to me

No arrows pointing forward or nuthin' I did make them two studs at the rear and one at the front like they are on the L series.

I do know they are left and right hand parts, one strut does not fit on both sides (duh)

As for your problem, looks like you may have to use the front hole and if it affects your steering geometry, make up the difference somewhere else? (longer radius rods

)

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 5:21 pm

got chatting to a quiet lad who knows his stuff, theory etc, related the 4WD position as a bit like Mercedes struts with a lean back approach for high speed stablity. Shoving a manual steer basic suspension set up like our 80's technology MY 4WD may just make them lighter in the steering, little bit more direct? in their steering when in FWD tarmac mode. Theoretically getting better contact when cornering .....

Maybe not so stable at speed on loose stuff??

It (the adjustable castor?) must have been a good idea at the time and did not continue with the L's

On left and right - Subaru altered their MY struts so they are one side fits both sides - ( i think ?? )

I think it will be a suck it and see. May need to heed the FWD alignment specs instead of 4WD

But Sam, there is a difference in which way the L mounts go, same with MY - the MY are stamped on top side of the metal mount with an arrow. With L, all need to do is view side on with mount out on its own, or with it out, shove a known flat thing on underside, on known flat bench and see about 4mm difference between the triangle tips to flat bench !

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 1:49 pm

OK, step back a little everyone , leave a bit of room for the ever helpful genuine Subaru parts man FROG to save the day.

Andy has offered to pull a strut from his wreck if still insitu, make some markings first , make some observes and share - before any HNY fluid flows

WATCH THIS SPACE !

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 3:34 pm

wha ?? Man, FROG eat sleeps breathes Subaru. Knocks off from Subaru, goes home thinking Subaru and has the answer.

Remove rubber cap from top side, centre of L Series strut mount.

get a rule or straight edge.

prepare to take a max of three measures off the top of the central rubber ring that just removed cap from. Sweep across, flat, towards each of the three mount to body studs.
Between these points is the top of a square lump of rubber looks a bit like a castle from a castle nut (aka axle nut with castles for split pin)

One of these three castles has less clearance than the other two.

Odd one out is the one to the front hole body to mount !!

Feels like an ad for an advisory help line eh ??

* might just be drinking stuff a bit harder than water t'sarvy

thanks heaps Andy - from Doms Motors Griffith !!

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 4:10 pm

Yeah! Thanks Andy!

*Goes outside to check own strut tops*

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 7:09 pm

Well there ain't much in it that's for sure! How's anyone supposed to figure that out, no arrows, no markings, no big fat "F" stamped anywhere but one of the tiny rubber nubs is 2mm shorter than the others...

Mine are all good now

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 9:54 pm

could cut 'em rubber castles off for fun and giggles

Good idea Sam - a letter stamp, or word stamp would help for next time !

Gannon · Post by **Gannon** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 7:14 am

Im lost, can you post some informative pictures of what is 2mm smaller than what?

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 8:09 am

what about more words ?

looking at the top of an L Series strut mount - under the bonnet will do.

the centre of it is a cup about 20c dia plugging up access hole to the roller bearing.

remove cup revealing a rubber ridge, looks like an end of a pipe.
stick a straight edge flatly, squarely across this central round ring, so as straight edge steps out towards one of the strut mount to body studs. Under the straight edge between centre pipe, circle and said stud, should be a square rubber blip, one for each stud. Check out the clearance between straight edge and top of square rubber blip. Check all three clearances, Two should be same, one odd clearance. That odd clearance one goes to front of strut tower, the other two equal ones are the two rearward stud accompaniers.

Oh, poop ! Guess what? Not all my strut mounts are the same to allow this clearance thing to happen as described above !!

But , essentially, the odd one out of the three pointed mount - goes to the front - until further notice

Here is first way I measured the difference

a mark on the top spring plate as reference for each point, measure, turn to next of the three points, measured from underside of the rubber encase flat head splined stud. 2mm difference found here !

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 9:21 am

OK, observation is, with the strut mounted in tower as I was originally intending, odd one to the front...car is jacked up on one side to work on it in a non floor location

strut is in , hanging , I set strut to sit in correct orientation, side bolt hole forward, rotate stut as if turning, let it go, which ever way I rotate the baby centres itself to straight ahead

Looking positive at this point in time

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 10:02 am

Hello to Gannon, hmm next hurdles are appearing....yes Gannon, the still max extended strut now positioned into place with radius rod and lower control arm - a coil rubs on the inside of the strut tower on turning - keeping in mind that the coil spring is not mounted equally around the centre pole of the strut

Gannon knows what happens when I lower the body weight on to it.

Also not mentioned elsewhere is the brake line bracket inside the strut/guard needs a minor tweest to prevent spring coil rubbing on it - or could be worse once lowered - needing some mods or new pipe and location.

Open a can of worms ....

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 10:18 am

Yeah even the L series struts with lift blocks in mine, one of the coils only just rubs right on the upper section on the inside of the strut tower, I'm hoping my longer L series LCA's push the strut out further than when it is just dangling like it is now. If I pull the bottom of the strut out by a tiny amount it clears the tower all the way around. Otherwise just bash the section out with a BFH; if your's is as minor as mine it won't take much to clear it.

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 10:58 am

yeah, got a bit of clearance to the booster on the other side

traipse outside in the hot sun to dismantle, look for that bfh ....

lucky I no do things up

or bleed brakes

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 11:50 am

Ah, so your's without a lift kit is a bit worse than mine with 2" lift. Still you can get away with it

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Jan 01, 2015 12:54 pm

yes, got the necessary no scrape by making a dimple that any tennis ball would be proud of.
now, having looked under a lot of cars and seen just how close things can be - i reckon an engineer will be satisfied with my work.

from rough measures i have gained 15mm eyebrow height and retained the firm suspension out of my old Project Cheap Grief GLTA sedan

now, for the other side.

Actually, i need to make up a mechanically fastened bracket for the brake hose as two models differ here also

Giving this a rest until the man who makes brake lines is done with holidays.

Funny thing about these L Series struts - the major offest of the spring, spring seat etc sits inbound from strut, where many other cars it sits outbound off the struts centre. I have found a position label on the one that came from the left of the donor - indicates it is for the right hand side! Have no choice due to the strut locking bolt into the hub. Fit them as suggested, tyres would likely rub. So, must be some sort of generic strut that fitrs the L ??