I am up to stage to clean up and fit cams to my 188,000km EA82 carb block. Using turbo mpfi heads (Willie, dicky severe worn K-line guide may have caused you trouble with these heads, new guides this time, welded head came up good in tests) with mpfi inlet manifold and trottle body fed by LPG and sparked by std dizzy.
Earmarked for my Brumby as the EA81 (engine #4 known to be in Brum) has about 450,000km on it and I have been trippin' over the EA82 carb block since I pulled it out 18 months ago. Got some timing covers and cam boxes and rocker covers all scrubbed up clean in the hot season - just gott afind tensioners etc, oil seals too... using the Mizpah reconditioned US$6 ea HVLA's too with gaskets by permaseal one torque technology
The poor thing has been subjected to overheating twice daily with former owner due to stuck thermostat and can see signs of bore scuffing and pock marks from the ceramic bits of a spark plug that broke off inside. Drove really well after new used t'stat fitted so hope all is in good enough order for long service
^^^^^ RAMBLE
REASON FOR POST >>
Cam selection is going to be a turbo cam due to my fuel requirements - LPG and that I may just strap the turbo bits on it at a later stage.
Some cams I marked as NA, others I assume are turbo and looking at the position of the ring ground along shaft as a factory indicator.
I find one pair of cams with idential turbo ring position as other pair, have an A cast into as a depression not raised at the front on the shaft visible only with rocker cover removed
Any detailed experience as far as these EA82T cams go? I do believe the power hike on imported EA82Ts is from change of cam only, maybe better fuel? pushng the figures higher up, higher up the rev range too.
So, start to ask is A for Aus?
EA82T enthusiasts are getting a bit thin on the ground not unlike the cars themselves.
Disco - where are you?
SWK ?
Extreme Justin is busy
Twilight Protege looks in, Sven 2, also makin a comeback
Steptoe wanders down to his shed.......
EA82T cam selection / markings
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sven '2'
- General Member
- Posts: 1357
- Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 5:45 pm
- Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Am no expect in EA82T cams other than there was guy years back that did a lot work with cams. His car was almost undrivable, power all over the place, couldn't idle, was woeful. But he was persistent, and then one day snapped, gave up, walked out his shed (noting that is where you are headed) caught a taxi and as legend has it has walked into dealership covered in grease & bought a new forester when they just out. I think he ended up with cams from the US - a gyrocopter supplier if memory serves me correct, but he was never the same man.steptoe wrote:
Any detailed experience as far as these EA82T cams go? I do wonder if the power hike on imported EA82Ts is from change of cam only, pushng the figures higher up, higher up the rev range too
EA82T enthusiasts are getting a bit thin on the ground not unlike the cars themselves.
Disco - where are you?
SWK ?
Extreme Justin is busy
Twilight Protege looks in, Sven 2, also makin a comeback
Steptoe wanders down to his shed.......
Had thought the AUDM EA82T had lower compression (to allow for our crap fuel) and this was achieved via different pistons?? Happy to be corrected on that though.
EA82T zealots - a decision in the heart only. Couldn't see myself going back unless I found a neat little RX sedan, free of molestation...I do miss the auto lane change feature when shifting into 3rd under WOT (with spider manifold goodness to assist)
Good luck!
Sven
73 Yamaha DT3 250
08 Ford BF wagon - LPG FTMFW
14 Toyota Kluger - goodness!
08 Ford BF wagon - LPG FTMFW
14 Toyota Kluger - goodness!
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T'subaru
- Junior Member
- Posts: 733
- Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 9:13 am
- Location: T'sunami Coast, Wa. ( usa )
http://deltacam.com/
A very popular cam, custom cam and regrind supplier here to the subaru community.
Cheers, mark
In washington state, usa
A very popular cam, custom cam and regrind supplier here to the subaru community.
Cheers, mark
In washington state, usa
'86 GL, '89 RX, '89 XT6, '90 T'sunami Wagon
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steptoe
- Master Member
- Posts: 11582
- Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:00 am
- Location: 14 miles outside Gotham City
still to get down to shed.... must have more cams somehere ??
on comp ratio all I ever found was 7.7:1 for all markets RX EA82T, so cam pushes power and torque about a bit changng figures. I also found different holes under turbo affecting power feel. 36mm or so torque down low, not really wanna spin near 6000 but with 42mm hole spins frely to 6000, 6500 in 2nd manual gear but less torque felt down low.
My budget has to stop somewhere on this experimMENTAL engine. My cam grinder moved to warmer climes, has to be close to retire age or beyond, I went against his years of experience advice with an EA81 cam 20/60 I lose power with load on board and ran warmer at that point. His max for EA81 was 16/56 for all rounder. He was CORRECT of course. With no load the 20/60 SNORTS
So, essentially with his advice a std turbo cam is also simliar good grind for LPG, eanie meanie minie moe, catch a figure by the toe (that is how I heard it before awareness of racism)
on comp ratio all I ever found was 7.7:1 for all markets RX EA82T, so cam pushes power and torque about a bit changng figures. I also found different holes under turbo affecting power feel. 36mm or so torque down low, not really wanna spin near 6000 but with 42mm hole spins frely to 6000, 6500 in 2nd manual gear but less torque felt down low.
My budget has to stop somewhere on this experimMENTAL engine. My cam grinder moved to warmer climes, has to be close to retire age or beyond, I went against his years of experience advice with an EA81 cam 20/60 I lose power with load on board and ran warmer at that point. His max for EA81 was 16/56 for all rounder. He was CORRECT of course. With no load the 20/60 SNORTS
So, essentially with his advice a std turbo cam is also simliar good grind for LPG, eanie meanie minie moe, catch a figure by the toe (that is how I heard it before awareness of racism)
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discopotato03
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2134
- Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:29 am
- Location: Sydney
Yes I'm still here though been v busy and crook a couple of times so not in this board too much nowdays .
EA82 camshaft ID markings . They have an A and B and C ID locations on them with the first or A section being common to all of them .
The B and C locations are behind the second cam lobe counting from the front of the camshaft .
I used to have the cam timing figures for the early or 85/86 era EA82T's but not sure where they are now . My factory WSM's are for the later mid 87+ L Series cars so I do have the ID configs timing numbers and lift .
Now don't quote me but from memory the duration for the early cams was the same as the later ones , one noticeable exception , but Fuji moved the opening and closing points around possible to better suit the later 4 plug ECU's controlled ignition timing maps .
I was going to use the Aus spec XT4 turbo cams because that's what engine was rebuilt for my 86 RX Turbo - Ellie .
I really don't think the USDM/JDM/ADM turbo cams varied that much but in one small part of Europe they did have emissions wise a dirtier and slightly more powerful version of the EA82 turbo engine .
There is a lot baseless talk about this version of the EA82T but all I could find out concrete was that the had a slightly larger ratio turbine housing on the turbo and slightly extended timing numbers on the camshafts exhaust lobes only .
I have a feeling that they may not have had a cat in the down pipe either .
With my engine build I was trying to get the engines static compression ratio a bit higher than the common to all 7.7:1 and to use NA camshafts because they have extended duration on the exhaust AND inlet lobes compared to most turbo EA82 cams .
Really increasing camshaft duration should go hand in hand with static compression ratio increases because that's to way to make an engine breathe better without losing bottom end torque . You need to understand that its the effective or dynamic compression ratio thats greatly affected by restrictions in inlet system design like the throttlebody itself .
Engines like EA82's have small ports and manifolds and I assume this is because the designers wanted them to pull well from lowish revs . They do not breathe or rev like later high performance multi valve engines do and there's not really enough meat in the heads or manifolds to significantly increase the gas paths .
The rally spec engines make no pretense of running well down low but noone cares much about how sweet a competition engine isn't because no one drives them to the shops . They use long period cams to keep the valves open longer in a glib attempt to get these engines to breathe and rev and killed bottom end power doing it .
The fact that EA82T's have no intercooling means its difficult to raise the static CR or boost pressure very far before they ping their heads off . Even if they were intercooled the piston crown and combustion chamber design is positively pre historic and detonation by and large has a lot to do with combustion efficiency .
Anyway enough of that , my WSM shows the later Aust spec EA82T cams as having A/0/1 in the ABC ID positions . In the B position zero means no grooves and in the C position two grooves . Their timing numbers are 14-56 56-14 . I'm using the late MPFI NA cams , thanks Gannon , which are A/0/3 and the timing numbers are 16-60 60-16 , 256 degrees of duration IN/EX compared to the turbo ones 250 IN/EX .
The dirty Euro turbo cams are A/1/1 and have 12-58 60-16 timing so 250/256 IN/EX durations . They advanced the inlet lobes (12-58) from 14-56 to bring the overlap timing back to the turbo cams 28 degrees . My NA cams have this warmer 60-16 exhaust timing but not the normal turbo cams shorter 14-56 inlet timing and 32 degrees of overlap (16 + 16) compare to either type turbo cams 28 deg ie (14 + 14) for the "normal" T cams or (12 + 16) in the case of the dirty Euro turbo engine cams .
As to if I gained anything out of the NA cams I can't say , I don't think I lost anything down low and anything that helps these engines breathe is a bonus provided its not too extreme .
Personally I wouldn't put money into aftermarket cams unless I was going racing/rallying because I think the NA cams are good enough for a roadie .
Gannon can tell you how Ellie goes because he went for a brief spin in it a few weeks back . The impression he gave me was that it revs well and makes a good spread of power for its modest 6-7 pounds of non intercooled boost .
A .
EA82 camshaft ID markings . They have an A and B and C ID locations on them with the first or A section being common to all of them .
The B and C locations are behind the second cam lobe counting from the front of the camshaft .
I used to have the cam timing figures for the early or 85/86 era EA82T's but not sure where they are now . My factory WSM's are for the later mid 87+ L Series cars so I do have the ID configs timing numbers and lift .
Now don't quote me but from memory the duration for the early cams was the same as the later ones , one noticeable exception , but Fuji moved the opening and closing points around possible to better suit the later 4 plug ECU's controlled ignition timing maps .
I was going to use the Aus spec XT4 turbo cams because that's what engine was rebuilt for my 86 RX Turbo - Ellie .
I really don't think the USDM/JDM/ADM turbo cams varied that much but in one small part of Europe they did have emissions wise a dirtier and slightly more powerful version of the EA82 turbo engine .
There is a lot baseless talk about this version of the EA82T but all I could find out concrete was that the had a slightly larger ratio turbine housing on the turbo and slightly extended timing numbers on the camshafts exhaust lobes only .
I have a feeling that they may not have had a cat in the down pipe either .
With my engine build I was trying to get the engines static compression ratio a bit higher than the common to all 7.7:1 and to use NA camshafts because they have extended duration on the exhaust AND inlet lobes compared to most turbo EA82 cams .
Really increasing camshaft duration should go hand in hand with static compression ratio increases because that's to way to make an engine breathe better without losing bottom end torque . You need to understand that its the effective or dynamic compression ratio thats greatly affected by restrictions in inlet system design like the throttlebody itself .
Engines like EA82's have small ports and manifolds and I assume this is because the designers wanted them to pull well from lowish revs . They do not breathe or rev like later high performance multi valve engines do and there's not really enough meat in the heads or manifolds to significantly increase the gas paths .
The rally spec engines make no pretense of running well down low but noone cares much about how sweet a competition engine isn't because no one drives them to the shops . They use long period cams to keep the valves open longer in a glib attempt to get these engines to breathe and rev and killed bottom end power doing it .
The fact that EA82T's have no intercooling means its difficult to raise the static CR or boost pressure very far before they ping their heads off . Even if they were intercooled the piston crown and combustion chamber design is positively pre historic and detonation by and large has a lot to do with combustion efficiency .
Anyway enough of that , my WSM shows the later Aust spec EA82T cams as having A/0/1 in the ABC ID positions . In the B position zero means no grooves and in the C position two grooves . Their timing numbers are 14-56 56-14 . I'm using the late MPFI NA cams , thanks Gannon , which are A/0/3 and the timing numbers are 16-60 60-16 , 256 degrees of duration IN/EX compared to the turbo ones 250 IN/EX .
The dirty Euro turbo cams are A/1/1 and have 12-58 60-16 timing so 250/256 IN/EX durations . They advanced the inlet lobes (12-58) from 14-56 to bring the overlap timing back to the turbo cams 28 degrees . My NA cams have this warmer 60-16 exhaust timing but not the normal turbo cams shorter 14-56 inlet timing and 32 degrees of overlap (16 + 16) compare to either type turbo cams 28 deg ie (14 + 14) for the "normal" T cams or (12 + 16) in the case of the dirty Euro turbo engine cams .
As to if I gained anything out of the NA cams I can't say , I don't think I lost anything down low and anything that helps these engines breathe is a bonus provided its not too extreme .
Personally I wouldn't put money into aftermarket cams unless I was going racing/rallying because I think the NA cams are good enough for a roadie .
Gannon can tell you how Ellie goes because he went for a brief spin in it a few weeks back . The impression he gave me was that it revs well and makes a good spread of power for its modest 6-7 pounds of non intercooled boost .
A .
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steptoe
- Master Member
- Posts: 11582
- Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:00 am
- Location: 14 miles outside Gotham City
Thanks Adrian. I got lost with the ID markings, I have the 85 86 manuals and it seems there are the ID rings ground out as the cam is done, in one of three positions, or no ground grooves at all. I have cams with a capital A just after front bearing , others have no marking here. I have made decision to use a pair of cams marked as such to have come from same engine (which is a good start) and has ring at first position from front in the middle section just after the hexagonal chunk. These are the same as what is in my better EA82T sitting on shed floor at the moment. Happy with them in that turbo motor so will just suck it and se how it goes as NA LPG to start with.
Went for a little clean up in shed and found more dirty cam boxes and rocker covers - all degreased and boxed away from dirt and crap. Found a tidy set of rockers, the 188,000 old belt tensioners, belt plastics cleaned and sorted - getting there
Went for a little clean up in shed and found more dirty cam boxes and rocker covers - all degreased and boxed away from dirt and crap. Found a tidy set of rockers, the 188,000 old belt tensioners, belt plastics cleaned and sorted - getting there
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steptoe
- Master Member
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- Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:00 am
- Location: 14 miles outside Gotham City
Caught you ! Bennie, it is you spreading mistruths is it? Thought this topic was sorted, done to death and toasted. The first thing I did when i popped a bonnet on a Brumby with EA82T in it was look at the clearance available between rocker covers and chassis - about 6mm each side of non modified, non cut chassis rails. Even have pics of a twin cam EJ in a Brumby (both were standard height too) the rails were not cut - rather massaged for clearance.
Thought I'd rather use up bits I have before I collect any EJ components
Thought I'd rather use up bits I have before I collect any EJ components
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steptoe
- Master Member
- Posts: 11582
- Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:00 am
- Location: 14 miles outside Gotham City
Bump for the perusal of a minority
Only mods to chassis were an unnecessary tap with a hammer. Heaps of room, just not for rocker covers off. Not rattling or knocking between EA82 and Brumby rails.El_Freddo wrote:So you'll be modifying the brumby's chassis rail to fit the EA82 in there? That's a lot of effort for little advantage in my opinion!