Raised Springs or Strut Lift

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:03 am

Now i've finished my wiring upgrade its time for the suspension

Trouble is i just cant make up my mind (i used to be indecisive but now i'm just not sure)

I need new springs/struts. The rear is sagging 1" & the struts are soft & "bouncy" all round. So i definitely need to replace em.

I could go with raised springs which will, i believe, give better road handling & 35mm increased height. Then some time later i could add 1" strut lifts from the states if i need to but this will be 2 1/2" total lift, which i understands needs to be engineered cos its more than 2".

Or i could get standard springs & 2" strut lift....

Its a '98 Forester so already has good ground clearance but i want more

I would prefer the 2 stage approach but i want to keep it legal.

What do others think?

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:14 am

I'd just go springs first unless you want to add struts at the same time and add $700, I'm running standard struts on mine and it's a 1000% improvement with just the springs, they say you must change the struts with the lifted springs but I'm running 98ish Foz struts & didn't need to.

RSR 555 · Post by **RSR 555** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:42 am

nachaluva wrote:Trouble is i just cant make up my mind (i used to be indecisive but now i'm just not sure)

Damn.. you too.. I too have this issue

nachaluva wrote:I need new springs/struts. The rear is sagging 1" & the struts are soft & "bouncy" all round. So i definitely need to replace em.

I could go with raised springs which will, i believe, give better road handling & 35mm increased height. Then some time later i could add 1" strut lifts from the states if i need to but this will be 2 1/2" total lift, which i understands needs to be engineered cos its more than 2".

Or i could get standard springs & 2" strut lift....

Its a '98 Forester so already has good ground clearance but i want more
I would prefer the 2 stage approach but i want to keep it legal.

What do others think?

Ok.. here's my thoughts

I'd go with the new struts (Non-turbo Forester ones of course because they are already higher than Turbo models) and new springs. Now I'm not sure if there is such an animal as raised springs or what I believe they are is just "Heavy Duty" (thicker coils) ones. These would do the job by holding up more weight before compressing. As this is a standard fit inside your macpherson strut setup, then there is no percieved 'extra' lift to speak of, so if you're still not happy with the height, then it's just a case of bolting in a 1" lift top blocks and Mr. Plod is happy

taza · Post by **taza** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:47 am

I have a 2001 SF Forester. I have Dobinson raised heavy duty springs the same as D_Generate. I also had to get new struts/shocks in the rear due to the stock ones collapsing and saggy springs.

I got 35mm lift in thwe rear and 30mm in the front. Then combine with Subtle Solutions 1" lift blocks (25mm). So just over 2". The springs give a good ride and are more heavy duty than stock so can handle a full load, trailer and people without much sag

Plus beacuse the back rides slightly higher when loaded up its just abit below level

I haven't of yet found clearance to be an issue which is good. More approach and departure angle from the bumpers

My insurance company said with the combination was legal because Dobinson only did that size springs for the Subaru Forester. All up the cost of new KYB struts/shocks the Dobinson springs all round and 1" Subtle Solutions strut blocks was around $1200. I haven't really lost any articulation and qwith swaybars disconnected I can almost get a 215/70R15 (27.5") wheel out of the wheel arch so its ok for a Subie.

Cheers
Taza

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:40 pm

d_generate wrote:I'd just go springs first unless you want to add struts at the same time and add $700, I'm running standard struts on mine and it's a 1000% improvement with just the springs, they say you must change the struts with the lifted springs but I'm running 98ish Foz struts & didn't need to.

Unfortunately i have to do the struts. If i jump on & off the towbar the car "bounces" up & down bout 1/2 doz times! If u do that with standard shocks they will compress then rise a little above level then back down. Really good shocks (struts) will just come back up to level. A great example of this is rally cars landing after a jump....the springs compress then back to level with no further movement, all under full power lol

& yeah i do have a leaning towards doing springs first...
Are your springs standard or raised?

RSR 555 wrote:Damn.. you too.. I too have this issue

I sometimes wonder if having been knocked out a few times has caused brain damage...but then i forget what i was thinking

RSR 555 wrote:Ok.. here's my thoughts I'd go with the new struts (Non-turbo Forester ones of course because they are already higher than Turbo models) and new springs. Now I'm not sure if there is such an animal as raised springs or what I believe they are is just "Heavy Duty" (thicker coils) ones. These would do the job by holding up more weight before compressing. As this is a standard fit inside your macpherson strut setup, then there is no percieved 'extra' lift to speak of, so if you're still not happy with the height, then it's just a case of bolting in a 1" lift top blocks and Mr. Plod is happy

Apparently the King Springs are "progressive", so they compress more easily at the start & get progressively stiffer. The advantage of this is you dont get the harshness of stiff springs, but still get the bonus of carrying extra weight without much sagging, plus better onroad handling.

I think the raised springs are taller plus stiffer...can anyone confirm this?

& i would like to keep Mr.Plod happy lol

taza wrote:I have a 2001 SF Forester. I have Dobinson raised heavy duty springs the same as D_Generate. I also had to get new struts/shocks in the rear due to the stock ones collapsing and saggy springs.

I got 35mm lift in thwe rear and 30mm in the front. Then combine with Subtle Solutions 1" lift blocks (25mm). So just over 2". The springs give a good ride and are more heavy duty than stock so can handle a full load, trailer and people without much sag Plus beacuse the back rides slightly higher when loaded up its just abit below level

I haven't of yet found clearance to be an issue which is good. More approach and departure angle from the bumpers

My insurance company said with the combination was legal because Dobinson only did that size springs for the Subaru Forester. All up the cost of new KYB struts/shocks the Dobinson springs all round and 1" Subtle Solutions strut blocks was around $1200. I haven't really lost any articulation and qwith swaybars disconnected I can almost get a 215/70R15 (27.5") wheel out of the wheel arch so its ok for a Subie.

Cheers
Taza

Havent heard of Dobinson springs. Do you like them?

I am worried bout the articulation. I think Venom has standard height springs with a body lift kit & i was very impressed with his setup.
I cant remember what El Freddo or Subaruby have (read abv brain injury lol) but they were both VERY good

I think i will do what you have done, just with King springs instead

taza · Post by **taza** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:12 pm

The King Springs are stiffer than the Dobinson springs. While King springs are small in size too and stiffer it helps with body roll. But Dobinson springs give a better ride but due to the rears being 5mm taller when loaded up they don't sag much.
Both have thier advantages. I am really happy with my articulation but only with swaybars disconnected. I will get a photo for you this afternoon.

Oh also Dobinson Springs are green not yellow

JPM · Post by **JPM** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:48 pm

My suspension is SF5 Forester, and I had the same issue with excessive bounce. I decided to do exactly what you are thinking, and I fitted front and rear Kings springs (parts KSRF and KSRR. The R stands for raised) and subtle solutions 1 inch lift blocks.

This certainly lifted the car even higher, but made the bounce even more pronounced as the springs were doing all of the work due to the shagged shocks. I recently installed Boge heavy duty shocks, and the difference between then and now is like chalk and cheese. The good shocks make so much difference to the ride and handling.

My advice is to bite the bullet and do everything at once- springs, shocks and subtle lift blocks! As Taza said the price to do everything is about $1200, but you are only pulling the struts out once!!

Also- Paul is dead right about the Kings Springs. They are called 'raised' but they are the same physic size as standard, however they are much stiffer and don't sag like the standard ones!

Jayd

Richie-Rich · Post by **Richie-Rich** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:44 pm

Hi All,

Well I went through this about a year ago.

97 Foz, went for HD springs and I replaced the rear shocks at the same time, they were out and had done 240000... At the same time I also installed a 2inch strut lift.

Car looks awesome and RSR can attest it is fairly high. I have run into some problems, due to being both $$ and time poor I have let fester.. The drive line has become noisy and the 2inch lift with the new spiring spells certain death for sway bar bushings etc. I have found it puts your running gear on quiet the angle. I originally tried the lifted (longer) HD coils, and they cannot fit with only a strut lift.

I am now waiting for the remainder of my lift kit, this will reduce the angles on the driveline and hopefully stop some of the groans.

All in all I would do it again, but I would take it straight to someone who knows what they are doing, and do the full 2inch lift in one hit.

Rich

Richie-Rich · Post by **Richie-Rich** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:47 pm

PS Pedders HD springs. They are RED so they must be good.

They do infact make a longer spring, from memory 35mm increased height.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 12:25 am

Hmmm...looks like i have some research to do lol.

I wont be doing a body lift for a while if i go that way.

I really do need new struts so i'll def be doing springs AND struts together. Just have to decide raised or standard...Kings or Dobinson....yellow green or red

I've heard KYB struts are the way to go...opinions?

Richie-Rich · Post by **Richie-Rich** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 2:45 pm

I put new KYB's in the back when the springs were done. Think it was $164 per strut in WA. Although it was a rush purchase...

Post by **Alex** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 2:48 pm

id go kyb struts and raised kings strait off the bat and see how it feels.

alex

taza · Post by **taza** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:13 pm

I pay $209 for each KYB strut for my SF Forester in Perth. Got the lot done at Malaga Springs and Suspension. Really helpful and did a great job. Pretty good one pricing too

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 7:58 pm

OK sounds good.

I think i'll go raised springs, prob Kings, plus KYB struts, drive around for a while then consider a strut lift or body lift.

Now to haggle some prices lol

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:51 am

I love the Dobinsons, I think 32mm higher than standard and give a factory ride on the Impreza, even with my rear sway bar cable tied up it handles pretty flat.....but I like to belt it around corners so it suits me fine (DCCD will be fun when I get back & we shove it in, like new & picked it up for $380) my Foz struts are in fairly good condition but they'll go one day for some KYB or similar.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:10 pm

So here's what i think i'll do:

Stage 1 (around $1200):
- new struts (KYB)
- new springs (HD raised kings)

Optional Stage 1 (about $500)
- whiteline HD sway bar links (will firm up on-road handling very nicely)
- whiteline anti-lift kit (increases camber/caster improving handling again)

Stage 2 (lift kit - $700, sump guard - $400, tyres - around $1000+):
- 2" body lift.
- Subaxtreme cast sump guard or a folded sheet guard from CrossBred Performance.
- 26 or 27" tyre, AT's are a really good compromise for a weekend warrior type off-roader.
- Have exhaust modded to suit lifted car (it will be up shit creek because all the mount points have moved). Source a second hand WRX cat back to go in for cheap improvement.

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:42 pm

nachaluva wrote:Optional Stage 1 (about $500)
- whiteline HD sway bar links (will firm up on-road handling very nicely)
- whiteline anti-lift kit (increases camber/caster improving handling again)

Make that stage 1.5 - I would say that you leave it be and see how the new struts and springs go as I think you'll be pleasantly surprised

Cheers

Bennie

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:22 pm

El_Freddo wrote:Make that stage 1.5 - I would say that you leave it be and see how the new struts and springs go as I think you'll be pleasantly surprised

Cheers

Bennie

Yep good idea.

Hopefully i'll get springs/ struts done in time for LDNP/ Robe, wait till later for the rest...

LIFTED · Post by **LIFTED** » Sat Oct 01, 2011 1:02 am

Can you buy or get taller struts, as this would then give you a lift and new struts to replace your bouncy ones at the same time.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:27 pm

mainbreak wrote:Can you buy or get taller struts, as this would then give you a lift and new struts to replace your bouncy ones at the same time.

good question...anyone know???

On King Springs website, it says standard OEM KYB struts are not compatable with rear springs (Kings):

SUBARU

97-6/02 FORESTER MY99 MY2000 MY2001 KSFS-22 KSFR-28 KSFR-32 KSRL-33** KSRS-33** KSRR-33***

*** WARNING THIS PART NUMBER NOT TO BE USED WITH O/E STRUT. RECOMMEND REPLACEMENT KYB 334191/2