talking clutches - pedal at top

[steptoe]

EA81 bigger diameter 225mm same as L series clutch pressure plate I gather on comparison

EDIT Part numbers suggest different pressure plates between L and MY in the 225mm

900-552 for the L Series 225mm has a 21mm step
900- 537 for the MY 225mm has a 23mm step

Wonder if step on MY flywheel was reduced to 21mm as in L Series I could just use the L Series clutch pressure plate

note to self compare clutch friction plate thickness

end edit


I have just swapped one out today and the other in. Not happy with result.

I knew the one this morning was with reco paint and looks to have new diaphragm spring as part of its reco - if that is a date stamp it is 09-97 and a fluke the other was stamped 1097 ?

The clutch I fitted this arvo was not new or reco, just assumed it was good when Brumby got written off. I reused good thick drive plate just swapped pressure plates.

WHY? Because the clutch pedal was right up the top like an on off button and felt it was likely to let me down at an inconvenient time. Only drove it in the yard but did not feel good at all this arvo after the swap

1 hour out, 1.5 in

Q are the bigger diameter clutches known to be hard bastards at the top of the pedal? My L Series clutch is just beaute, it is same diameter.

Is it same leverage for MY lever on 225mm clutch or less?

When and if a flywheel is correctly machined retaining the step the clutch moves a little closer to the crank, a little further away from the lever - i suppose cable adjustment takes care of both wear and that small change in position.

Can't recall if adjustment of the pivot pont ball in the gearbox bellhousing is adjustable or is meant to be adjusted for flywhel changes due to machining.

I wanna clutch I can feel or anyone else that drives it for that matter.
Gonna tinker with spare flywheel and old clutch bits to watch and measure the spring tension changes as I tighten cover to flywheel - not now, going to bed

Any experiences with renewing these EA81 225mm clutches appreciated, especially if you got good pedal

Jonno

[steptoe]

I may have stuffed up, no, I am certain I fitted the pressure pate from the Brumby wreck.

I have been to see a guy and gone through his old but detailed listings to find they list a different number for 225mm pressure plate between EA81 and EA82 , interested to know if one now supercedes the other edit - can't due to step differences between EA81 and EA82

Copied notes, borrowed a clutch book

Something to note is some are 21mm steps in fly , some are 23mm steps.

piecing these ramblings together, All EA82 5 speed L Series use same 225mm x 25.2mm x 24 spline clutch plates covers, throw out and pilot bearings with 21mm step in flywheel - makes it simple then huh?

All EA81's listed show 23mm step in flywheel

The borrowed book suggests hard clutch can be due to cable and says go genuine. My cable slides nice, but my clutch is both towards top of pedal and bloody hard

The key is 21 spline is on 4 speeds = MY, gets confused when the options were 200mm or 225mm plates/ discs

24 spline on 5 speeds = L Series

Looking at US supplier specs use imperial measures of 7 7/8" and 8 7/8" , not 200 and 225mm

Convert 200mm 25.4mm = 1 inch, so I guess 7 7/8 is 200mm, 8 x 0.4mm must be about 1/8" 4x 8 = 32 think 1/8" is 3.175mm

OK so they are 8" and 9" clutches in a rough kind of way




There is going to be a different feel from the same clutch in different car as the throw out bearing being different 4 speed to 5 speed, they push on different spot on fingers = different leverage. With L Series 5 speed in my EA81 powered Brumby I use Gemini clutch disc R7926 with 200mm pressure plate but retain the 4 speed throw out bearing and arm. This is not the car I am playing with the hard pedal. It is non modded EA81 4 speed with bigger 225mm clutch

[steptoe]

also, find the 200 and 225 Brumby clutches do not share same throw out bearing.

Now wondering if both bearings fit to same fork or is fork also different.

[steptoe]

still talking to myself here

Have found that same clutch book lists two different sets model codes I don't understand of same years 82 - 84

One uses the normal TBR326 throw out bearing same as the 200mm clutch, the other set uses TBR336.

So, to continue this line of thought before I get the spanners out again it will help to see the physical differences between TBR326 and TBR 336

May turn out that wrong throwout bearing was fitted to the clutch fork before I got to it - BINGO ?

[Jeff]

If you machine the step in the EA81 flywheel to match the EA82 flywheel you then just use an L Series clutch

[steptoe]

Hi Jeff, so this is a done before sort of thing, machine to L Series 21mm step in fly, use L Series clutch kit and Bob's everyones Uncle?
Just thinking a flywhel gets clutch at least 2mm closer to engine there must be some adjustment of the pivot pint forward or just slack taken up by cable adjustment?

Any idea on the different throw out part numbers ??

[phillatdarwin]

can not put a MY in a L as the splines are not the same as a L in for the input shaft to the box

[Jeff]

Correct i assumed he was talking about a 5 speed conversion

[steptoe]

Mostly there, to fit the 225mm 21 spline disc with the L pressure plate and 21mm step - may be up to me to find out !!
It's alright Jeff, sort of get confused myself with what I am across

[TOONGA]

Ive read this and it has just dawned on me

my clutch pedal squeaks but it doesn't talk

but I do know if you want to use a brumby flywheel and L series clutch (21 spline or 24) spline and pressure plate the flywheel needs to be machined to stop the clutch from slipping, and change the pedal and cable over to the stronger L series stuff to help with the stiffer feel of the clutch

TOONGA

[steptoe]

gotta tell you my L clutch is way soft compared to this clutch i am playing with at present

[steptoe]

Learning more....trivia 184

Found markings on the clutch cover I took out suggests it is reco with an X for exchange as much as I suspected with the blue metallic paint all over everything as is the norm for reco stuff

X900 - 537 so it is the correct pressure plate according to charts for all EA81 4 speed - hmm did not look at what the 5 speed FWD listed !.

The steps are correct on spare assorted flywheels and assume the one in-car is also correct to a point

Compared to a pressure plate for an EA82, the centre hole of the diaphragm spring fingers of the EA81 is noticeably smaller.

The EA81 4 speed clutch release bearing I have in my old bits is also smaller diameter at its contact point.

Looking at another EA81 with 5 speed L Series box it is using the L fork with the EA81 throwout release bearing for its 8 inch clutch, which now strikes me as odd as the black EA82 fork is wider than the blue EA81 4 speed fork at the point where release bearing fits ??

Comparing forks, the ball pivot point is not the same distance away from centre of where release bearing sits - I think, so looks like not to mix forks and boxes


Mix n match an L pressure plate (using 21mm step fly) onto the MY fly with 23mm step pressure plate bolts down flat to fly but suspect it would have stuff all clamp force - has enough not to be able to turn drive plate. If done the other way the MY pressure plate on an L fly the pressure plate will not bolt down flat on fly due to the 2mm difference in the step.

Starting to blow away my thrifty idea of machining an MY fly to 21mm step in order to use a spare L Series CPP, the MY 4 speed 21 spline clutch disc unles I can get the 4 speed fork to take the L Series clutch release bearing - goes the other way on the 5 speed in MY ??

Ooh my head hurts with this, sorry if yours does too

So, I will have to pull the bugger out again to compare with what I now suspect to be wrong TBR (Throwout Bearing Release) and see if I can find specs on both the TBR 326 and TBR 336 - one is thought to be bigger than the other, though the marks on clutch presure plate I pulled shows to be contacting right on inner edges of fingers ????

[steptoe]

Learning more....trivia

Found markings on the clutch cover I took out suggests it is reco with an X for exchange as much as I suspected with the blue metallic paint all over everything as is the norm for reco stuff

X900 - 537 so it is the correct pressure plate according to charts for all EA81 4 speed - hmm did not look at what the 5 speed FWD listed !.

Compared to a pressure plate for an EA82, the centre hole of the diaphragm spring fingers of the EA81 is noticeably smaller.

The EA81 4 speed clutch release bearing I have in my old bits is also smaller diameter at its contact point.

Looking at another EA81 with 5 speed L Series box it is using the L fork with the EA81 throwout release bearing for its 8 inch clutch, which now strikes me as odd as the black EA82 fork is wider than the blue EA81 4 speed fork at the point where release bearing fits ??

[steptoe]

Well, I'll be ! I fitted what must be (not must be IS ) a 21mm step pressure plate from an L Series to a 23mm step EA81 flywheel and it worked, was driveable but sometimes couldn't select first from neutral, sometimes got a nick sort of gear change but it had enough clamp force not to slip even though there was a 2mm difference in the specs !! I missed the fact in my rush that it did not need the cover bolts to wind it in to the flywheel clamping as it goes, missed the larger hole in the fingers (no I didn't) I remember sizing the bearing up to it) Still had a hard pedal at the top. Hard may be due to the divots below

Also found that by not closely inspecting the clutch release bearing 'sleeve' (as Subi calls it) I did not see the great divots the steel fork was wearing into the sleeve creating more friction for the pedal feel and slack for the cable to take up.The surface should be a flat machined surface. Fitting a clutch pro KSU23002 kit with new $60 sleeve from Subaru and all should be back to correct spec.

[steptoe]

Righto, like to finish something I started.

Engine went in in an easy relaxed 80 minutes from lift off the floor to drive out the door. The cable adjustment makes me think it may be stretched as it is at its max adjustment with all the new bits. Tell you what with all pivots greased up new clips on the new sleeve (love that with Japanese and Fuji new clips available for a few bucks) it all feels like I expect a clutch to.

Job sorted