Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

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El_Freddo
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by El_Freddo » Mon Jan 29, 2024 8:27 pm

Ooh exciting!

You can only ask about the filming. They may ask to not have any identifying features or themselves in the video - you can only ask! Or get them to do it the way they want it…

Now, make sure you sleep every night between now and then! :razz:

Cheers

Bennie
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Bumpty » Tue Jan 30, 2024 8:35 am

Silverbullet wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2024 6:58 pm
Progress today, she moves! :razz: I made the last bracket (I think) for this conversion project being the engine stay rod bracket. Just for fun(?) and being that I started later in the evening, I made this one entirely without power tools except a cordless drill, and the welder of course. I tell ya, cutting through that much 5mm plate with a hacksaw and hand file really makes the finished product feel special and valuable :lol:

Started with a cardboard template of course (not pictured)
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Gave the stay rod the cut and shut treatment, then both a new lick of satin black of course.
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Fired her up and attempted to back out. Some faff with the clutch not disengaging, me winding it all the way in, moved it, then the clutch decided it was actually too far in so I had to put it back :roll: But it moves and changes gears, time for a much needed bath (it was diabolically filthy with dust)
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Couldn't resist going for a lap around the back streets, which immediately revealed huge problems with the tune/base map. Death rattle as soon as fed any sniff of throttle into it when moving. Took 15 degrees of timing out of the map, better but still not enough. Put more fuel in the fuel map, better but still not enough. Every time it would start easier and idle better, the ECU and I are both learning. It really is time for a dyno session now, I shouldn't drive it any more for risk of damaging the engine. It was weird with the badly tuned run, it sounded and felt exactly like the old EA twin carb :lol: Had a small scare with the P/S pump sounding like it was up the creek for a while, seems it took ages to actually burp/bleed the air out.

Man was it ever weird being in the old girl again after 6 months in the Foz, it felt so low and cramped in comparison :lol:
Woooohooo! It must have felt fantastic taking it for that small raz around the block despite the tune (or lack thereof and other issues)!


PS: That bracket looks well done too.

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Silverbullet
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Tue Feb 06, 2024 8:22 pm

Dyno day got moved to Thursday now :roll: The tuner had some excuse about moving house. So I moved my day off, re-scheduled the tow truck and have to wait one more day.

This arvo after work I got 40L of 98 RON in jerry cans to put in (he wants a full tank for tuning) Plus another <10L I had in the shed, and maybe <10L that was already in the car. I got barely half of the first jerry in before it was backing up the filler neck and not draining down...oh not more bloody fuel filling issues :evil: (have had issues like this since I got it back on the road 2 years ago) I suspected mud-wasp blockages since I had the vent lines on the car open while the tank was out and long story short, yep, no fewer than SIX(!!) separate mud blockages in the vent lines. All 3 that go up to the vapor separator were blocked, the hard line around the side of the tank, and the L shaped one from the middle to the side. After I got them cleared still couldn't fill at full speed. Pulled the large rubber hose from the filler neck vent off at the tank end and put the air gun into it blowing back up towards the cap, blocked, then POP hissssss. Filler neck was then full of dusty sandy debris...nice :roll: Those teeny tiny little solitary wasps are a true menace, any little hole, oriface or hose open to them they will block it with mud within weeks.

After that got all the fuel I had into it and wahey, fuel guage goes right up to full now! never did that before. I estimate between 50 and 60L is in there at the moment, a good sign for total capacity gained.

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by El_Freddo » Wed Feb 07, 2024 9:21 pm

I hope you didn’t do that work tonight just before it’s off to the dyno tomorrow!

I’ve watched these wasps fill the gaps in a crank cam gear on a ledge near my project - amazing how they fill in the round holes as well as the elongated holes!

I hope all goes well with the tuning! Will you be driving it home, I hope so. Fingers crossed for you!

Cheers

Bennie
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Thu Feb 08, 2024 6:26 pm

Ah well, today was an interesting day, but alas she's coming home on a tow truck tomorrow :roll: Won't be driving it for a while.

The short story:
- fuel return line is definitely too small, need to change it to 6mm hard line or 8mm hose
- throttle position sensor is definitely bad, with no input from pedal the number on screen jumps around between 0 and 0.4%
- Wideband reading glitches/jumps around pointing to a power/ground issue with the wideband controller box
And the biggest/main problem
- Random misfire on cylinder 1 or 3 which throws the AFR into disarray, can't tune it like that. Can hear a ticking/clicking in that area which comes and goes, seems to go along with the misfire.

The long story:
So they want me to take the (new) Hitachi injectors out and get them flow bench tested, to see if they're actually working right. We know(?) the ignition isn't causing the misfire since we had new clean plugs, measured resistance of the ignition leads, and in desparation swapped the coil for the one out of my daily Forester which made no difference. Valve clearances were on the table until a compression test showed 200psi in all four cylinders. They want me to move the ECU ground from the intake manifold/cylinder head directly to the battery negative post along with moving powers and grounds on a few other things.

So my money if not the injectors is on the loom underneath the intake manifold (which I didn't/couldn't rebuild from scratch) being bad, going along with the theme of everything second-hand being utter crap. James who spent the whole day with me said this was the hardest engine he's ever had to tune...a freshly rebuilt stock N/A EJ20 :lol: :roll: The part I'm most sad about is the engine is probably going to suffer damage now until I fix the misfire since it can't be driven and broken in properly. But I have literally no other choice but to plow on regardless.

*EDIT* 5/16" aluminium hard line, tube bender and bead rolling tool ordered, new fuel return line is in the works. Determinted to keep it inside the car, not P-clipped to the underside in the firing line when belly-sliding through the sand on the beach at Gleesons landing :lol:

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Subyroo » Thu Feb 08, 2024 9:32 pm

Bugger! You didn't need all that crop up.
I admire your determination and not to accept defeat though.

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Thu Feb 08, 2024 9:47 pm

Here's a little clip from the tailpipe, you can (just) hear the misfire as a little fluttery sound out the back

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/lcc8MMIOyCQ

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by El_Freddo » Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:58 am

Whaaat?? I’m gobsmacked!

I can’t work out how so many issues have arisen like this! I’ve never heard of the intake wiring loom being an issue like this. The first thing that came to mind is the earth straps/wires from the body to the engine and gearbox, and the one from the negative battery to the block.

I thought you already had a 6mm return line :mmm: Only other thing I can think of is a restriction at the hanger pump return line, even then this is a stretch.

This doesn’t make sense to me.

Also don’t stress about your engine. It will be fine. These little hiccups are being found and the engine shutdown. If you were to continue driving like this for the run in period then yes, you may have permanent damage or an early failure. I doubt you’ll experience either. Since the engine is showing compression at 200psi on all four I wouldn’t be worried about it.

Now might be a good time to go pull an intake manifold off a yard parts car that’s the same as yours and swap it over. Seems you have far too many issues going on with that setup which I still find baffling.

I’d be about ready to throw my arms in the air and cry. Your resilience in this build is honourable!

I’m chasing a constant CEL issue in a project that has me stumped - almost looks like it’s an issue of stored codes but it never had a CEL in the donor when it was running (a number of years ago now though!). I can’t complain about it now as it’s nothing compared to what you’re dealing with!

Hopefully there’s a brainwave and slap your face moment on the horizon that fixes everything!

Cheers

Bennie
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Fri Feb 09, 2024 4:18 pm

El_Freddo wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:58 am
Now might be a good time to go pull an intake manifold off a yard parts car that’s the same as yours and swap it over. Seems you have far too many issues going on with that setup which I still find baffling.
Even this I don't think would help anything given recent experience, there's no guarantee any of it would work properly. I think to solve it that way, nothing less than a perfectly running, driving car would need to give up its donor manifold to see if it fixes my issues.

Dad said that the car is rejecting this new engine, it's doesn't want it, put it back to carbie :lol:

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by El_Freddo » Fri Feb 09, 2024 4:37 pm

Did you tell your dad he’s funny?

Other thing to ask: what voltage does the ECU use for the various sensors and can this be changed within the ECU parameters?

If you’re going to the point of a donor vehicle you might as well cut down the factory wiring loom, throw that in and call it a day…

What’s the plan now, all new sensors from Haltech or Subaru? That’ll add up quickly :-x

Cheers

Bennie
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Fri Feb 09, 2024 10:15 pm

El_Freddo wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2024 4:37 pm
Did you tell your dad he’s funny?
Yes, and that I'm stubborn as a mule and I will beat this thing into submission one way or other :lol:
Other thing to ask: what voltage does the ECU use for the various sensors and can this be changed within the ECU parameters?
Can't be changed, there's no need. Some sensor inputs allow software enabled, pull up/pull down resistors (only temp sensors really)

-The cam and crank sensors each have their own dedicated "+" and "-"
-The TPS uses 3 wires = 5v, sensor ground and signal back to the ECU. It's just a potentiometer, 3 legs making a voltage divider.
-Only other thing I have using the sensor 5v is the fuel pressure sensor = 5v, sensor ground, signal back to the ECU
-Coolant and intake air temp each have 2 wires = sensor ground and signal back to the ECU
-IACV has 3 wires = IGN 12v+, ground and signal from the ECU
If you’re going to the point of a donor vehicle you might as well cut down the factory wiring loom, throw that in and call it a day…
I'm not going that far, no space or budget for a donor vehicle. I'd sooner make a new engine loom from scratch because it would be a better end result. But just can't buy the plug and pin connector kits for the factory hardware for love nor money.
What’s the plan now, all new sensors from Haltech or Subaru? That’ll add up quickly :-x

Cheers

Bennie
The only factory sensors I'm using currently are cam, crank and TPS. Cam and crank readings are all rock solid with no errors. TPS signal jumps around even with the TPS disconnected which is truly bizarre, can't work out why. Got a new genuine TPS coming anyway. The other sensors I mentioned are already new from Haltech. The ECU has its own onboard MAP sensor.

Plan now is:
-get the new injectors flow bench tested with a printed, measured data sheet for each. Flow rate and dead time.
-make the bigger fuel return to get predictable, stable and consistent fuel pressure
-change the fuel pressure reg for a quality adjustable aftermarket unit since I can't rule out the 2nd hand factory one leaking fuel into its vacuum line causing the misfire on that side.

Today I moved some power and grounds around so the wide band controller box is powered from the exact same power and ground as the ECU.
Also removed the Subaru ECU grounding lug from the intake manifold (next to the coil) and crimped on a fat extension cable, with a ring terminal under the same bolt on the head where the battery negative is.

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Subyroo » Sat Feb 10, 2024 12:09 pm

Silverbullet wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2024 10:15 pm
I'm not going that far, no space or budget for a donor vehicle. I'd sooner make a new engine loom from scratch because it would be a better end result. But just can't buy the plug and pin connector kits for the factory hardware for love nor money.
Silverbullet:
Remember, I am not Subaru literate, I have only owned a 2000 RX Liberty & a 2003 Forester. I have never physically worked on either one, I left that to the experts at Boxer Service in Brendale QLD. :mrgreen:
I can ask around on a couple of other Subaru forums that I visit form time to time, to see if anybody has any ideas on a supplier & if they maybe available.
What do you need in the way of pin connector kits for the factory hardware?
You will have make up a list of sorts so I know what I'm asking for.

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by El_Freddo » Sat Feb 10, 2024 2:58 pm

Hey SB, you should be able to repin the factory plugs to reuse them with new pins. You just need the correct tool and new pins - Halteck might be able to help out with those items. Could be a good excuse for a u pull it run to get a set of plugs 8-)

That TPS reading is concerning and I doubt a new TPS will solve that issue. I’m trying to remember if there’s anything from the TPS is shielded between it and the ecu. I can’t see this on my project so I’d have to reference the wiring diagram on the computer - this is going to bug me now!

I’ll get back to you later about that shielded wire thought unless you beat me to it!

Cheers

Bennie
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Sat Feb 10, 2024 6:24 pm

Well I've made a liar out of myself in regard to connectors. Dunno where I was looking before but I found them today with a single google search :roll:

https://iwireusa.com/

Only downside they're in USA but I don't care. They have the entire suite of connectors plug and pin kits I need except the alternator but that's easy to get. They even have the 16 and 20 pin connectors that are near the bellhousing, which I thought were un-obtainium. Wish I'd found these guys back at the start of the conversion :lol:

In regards to TPS error, my troubleshooting brain working on that. I've decided I will de-pin that single wire from the ECU and see the result on screen. If flickering goes away, it's a wiring issue 100%. AFAIK that TPS wire is not shielded, it doesn't need to be for just an analog voltage back to the ECU.

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Subyroo » Sun Feb 11, 2024 12:54 pm

Good to hear that you found a site for your pin connector plugs.

I stumbled across another place for JDM parts day before yesterday, but lost the link and had to go searching for it again.
This site has OEM parts for a range of vehicles. Unfortunately I haven't seen anything for the earlier Subaru's or even my Honda HRV. :( :(

https://www.nengun.com/

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Sun Feb 18, 2024 8:06 pm

Productive weekend this one, harvested another 60-80kg of honey and today got the new return line made out of 5/16" aluminium hard line :razz: So if my fuel pressure is still too high now we can't blame the return line, as this is the same size as the return line in the Commodore which the fuel pump is out of!

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Didn't expect to get it finished when I started this arvo. First time I've used hard line for anything. It was fiddly but not too hard. The ally tube was super soft and forgiving. Put one or two bends in the wrong place and it was easy enough to straighten back out with no ill effects. I made the front end shape in 2.4mm steel TIG wire to begin with, then copied that with the tube. The rear end was easy enough to put straight into the tube with no template. Hardest part was fiddling the finished item through the interior without bending it or scratching the outside of the car :roll: Got a neat little tool which put a barb of sorts in the end of the tube. It's bolt shaped with 3 ball bearings that poke out incrementally from the inside.

Dropped the injectors off last Monday to get flow bench tested and a printed report...they said it will be 3 weeks :cry: Was going to wait on those results before I pulled the trigger on the new wiring gear but don't think I can wait that long. But alas too many bills all at once this fortnight, the wiring will have to wait anyway.

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by El_Freddo » Sun Feb 18, 2024 8:56 pm

Neat work with the fuel line!

Hijack/side discussion:And how many hives are we taking for that amount of honey? That’s a fair effort! I’m early in my bee keeping journey with a flow hive - I want to clean out the flow frames this winter… anyway, probably should start a new discussion about that! Do you sell your honey or are you into it so much that you’ll eat that amount with your family across the year? (Seems excessive!)

Cheers

Bennie
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Tue Mar 12, 2024 9:13 pm

El_Freddo wrote:
Sun Feb 18, 2024 8:56 pm
Hijack/side discussion:And how many hives are we taking for that amount of honey? That’s a fair effort! I’m early in my bee keeping journey with a flow hive - I want to clean out the flow frames this winter… anyway, probably should start a new discussion about that! Do you sell your honey or are you into it so much that you’ll eat that amount with your family across the year? (Seems excessive!)
That was around 2 and a half hives worth. I run 9 conventional honey frames in a 10 frame box on my hives so they build the comb out super deep. This gets me more honey per box than using 10 frames. Around 25kg from one box if everything is perfect (it rarely is :roll: ) usually closer to 20. I've seen flow hive frames and they're pretty deep, but only 6 or 8 frames in the honey super? Cleaning the frames was my main concern with those, being all plastic but I think you can completely dismantle the halves correct? I sterilize my wood frames with steam and fire, not really plastic compatible :lol:

Latest news for anyone who didn't see this weeks video is I got the injectors back last Friday and got them in Friday night. Fuel pressure shot up to 100psi again on first fuel prime :roll: Eventually discovered my pickup-come-return hard line inside the fuel tank is completely blocked solid. Which is very very strange since it wasn't like that when I put petrol in it for the first time. Anyway I just dropped the fuel tank and re-routed the return into the commodore MRA return port, easy, fuel pressure was then stable 43.5 psi with the engine running.

Drove the car round the block a few times on the sub-standard tune, it is drivable but not really happy. It was 37 degrees out and the temp gauge didn't even get half way, nice! :razz: I don't remember hearing the fans come on either. Also happy to report nothing has leaked out of it since being parked, not one drop, also nice!

The random misfire and the jumpy TPS signal are both still present though. To that end I've just ordered a complete suite of new connector plug+pin kits from iWire in the USA. Also 100m of 18awg TXL wire in various colors. The intake manifold is coming off and I'm making a new engine loom from scratch, my way, with no wiring faults.

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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by El_Freddo » Sat Mar 16, 2024 9:53 pm

Ooh that’ll be an interesting job replacing all of that wiring and sensors!

I hope it works out for you. I’m still trying to get my head around how you’ve had so many issues with all of the factory wiring and sensors. It doesn’t add up. Hopefully that wiring loom will sort out your issues. Maybe there’s some pinched wiring somewhere in the loom you’re unaware of.

As for the honey that’s a massive effort. I like your move with the one less frame to gain more honey. How’d you work that out?

The flow hive has 6 flow frames. Very simple to harvest once you know which frames you’re aiming for. As for cleaning them, that’s up to the bees. They clean out and refill the flow frame cells, all I seem to need to do is keep the hive healthy and keep an eye on how full the frames are to get the harvest time right. Apparently a flow frame can get 3.5kg of honey when completely full. The colour difference between harvesting different frames is crazy.

Anyway, that’s a bit of a hijack…

Cheers

Bennie
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Re: Silverbullets' resto: Engine, gearbox, suspension

Post by Silverbullet » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:46 pm

Heh hijack or not, I love talking about bees :mrgreen: In regards to "cleaning" frames, one thing you might struggle with is propolis on plastic frames. Depends on the colony, some make more propolis than others. They use it to glue everything together and block up holes and gaps they don't like. It's a darker brown than the wax and very sticky. I chewed on a piece once and no joke it tasted strongly of eucalyptus menthol!

Some happier car related news today I picked up my re-chromed tailgate trim. The piece above the number plate that houses the lock and door handle. The one on the car currently is broken so I took my original 1981 not-broken piece to A class metal finishers in Lonsdale. This process started last November, just got it back today :lol:
It looks stunning, better than new!
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