Raised Springs or Strut Lift

Venom · Post by **Venom** » Sun Oct 02, 2011 10:37 am

Is that to do with self levelling suspension?

Maybe shoot them an email about it.

taza · Post by **taza** » Sun Oct 02, 2011 12:42 pm

nachaluva wrote:good question...anyone know???

On King Springs website, it says standard OEM KYB struts are not compatable with rear springs (Kings):

SUBARU

97-6/02 FORESTER MY99 MY2000 MY2001 KSFS-22 KSFR-28 KSFR-32 KSRL-33** KSRS-33** KSRR-33***

*** WARNING THIS PART NUMBER NOT TO BE USED WITH O/E STRUT. RECOMMEND REPLACEMENT KYB 334191/2

It said the exact thing on the Dobinson website when I went to get my springs. Also after clarrifying with a suspenion mob it means that you should get the replacement part number listed above for new rear struts. Then put your raised Kings into those new KYB struts. They said you could put other srings into your existing Self Leveling crap but then it would self level to stock height plus with the offroad work or heavy -ish loads they would likely collapts anyway and go below stock height. They aren't tough enough to handle that kind of workload. Mine had already collapsted in my 2001 Forester before I got the new suspenion setup put in. so i went ahead and got the new KYB's.

Taza

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Sun Oct 02, 2011 12:47 pm

Good explanation Taza.

I think it also has something to do with spring rates & valving.

Anyway I've sent an email to King Springs, will let you know what they say.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:17 pm

just got off the fone to King Springs fella in Qld...very helpful.

It seems the raised springs are longer, not stiffer:

Front:

Standard: 305mm; 230 lb/in2
Raised: 350mm; 185 lb/in2

Rear:

Standard: 340mm; 175 lb/in2
Raised: 360mm; 175 lb/in2

So the front raised springs are actually LESS stiff than standard height, whereas the rears are the same.

These are King Spring rates which he said are stiffer than OEM springs.

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:35 pm

Meh, I'm still running the std Foz struts & it's way higher than it was with the std springs, personally I think it's a way of selling another part, they can stay till they die or I'm feeling generous. I bought a set of KYB's and stuck them in the front and it was exactly the same height so took them back, I'm going to try to find out if Outback fronts are longer, I have a feeling they might be..........Guy, you've got some, any idea?

longy99gt · Post by **longy99gt** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:12 pm

i have the 2" strut top lift, and if i had the cash i would have gone with KYB's and Kings/dobinsons instead
that way you get clearance and handling improvements, and you wont need any more lift after that either.
between that combo set and taller tires, its an awesome foz,
i may later on just get better condition std struts, coz mine have collapsed (out of an overall 3" lift, the rear is 1" below stock, thats how collasped they are....) and then just add HD springs, but NOT raised.... that way i have the lift, and strong springs, and already have upgraded rear sway bar for handling. Good luck with yours!

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 2:13 pm

Woohoo they've arrived

:mrgreen::mrgreen:

I decided on Kings raised springs front & back & KYB struts.

the part No.s are:
King Springs: KSFR-32; KSRR-33;
KYB: Back: 334191; 334192; Front: 334189; 334190.

I did lots of calling around to various stores in the cheaper "bogun" suburbs, got some good prices then called Super cheap Auto, Repco & Autobarn just around the corner from me.
After some good haggling we agreed on a price, I paid & the springs/struts were ordered in.

just picked em up...now have to stick em in.

It feels like Christmas lol

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Tue Oct 11, 2011 9:08 pm

So when do we see the pics of your foz and these new springs/struts installed???

Cheers

Bennie

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Tue Oct 11, 2011 10:00 pm

Haha yeah i prob should post some lol.

Just waiting for the springs to settle down, its sitting up a little at the front, looks bit funny.
At the moment the ride height is 470mm (front) & 455mm (rear).

Handles sooo well, at least compared to the old struts which were well & truly shagged!

Just got the wheel alignment done...they really took their time, adjusting front & rear for maximum camber. Unfortunately its slightly positive

Front camber: 0.11' (L) 0.18' (R)
Rear camber: 0.02' (L) 0.05' (R)

They showed me the rear camber adjustment & said i need camber bolts to get neg camber.
For the front suggested Pedders strut bend...they actually bend the base of the strut! Not sure bout that option tho...any ideas?

Venom · Post by **Venom** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:54 am

Slightly positive is fine, although the fronts probably have a little bit too much. Most important is that the camber is similar for L and R.

Whiteline do a camber adjustment bolt for the front which replaces the botton bolt in the strut so that both the top and botton bolt have some adjustment. Actually i've got a set sitting here that i never bothered to use in my car.

Another option is the whiteline antilift kit. It will push the front wheel forward and outward slightly which gives just enough extra camber in the front that you can make it close to zero or slightly negative. It gave me enough camber that i decided not to use the camber bolts. It will give a firmer ride too and consequently increase NVH slightly.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:34 am

Venom wrote:Slightly positive is fine, although the fronts probably have a little bit too much. Most important is that the camber is similar for L and R.

Whiteline do a camber adjustment bolt for the front which replaces the botton bolt in the strut so that both the top and botton bolt have some adjustment. Actually i've got a set sitting here that i never bothered to use in my car.

Another option is the whiteline antilift kit. It will push the front wheel forward and outward slightly which gives just enough extra camber in the front that you can make it close to zero or slightly negative. It gave me enough camber that i decided not to use the camber bolts. It will give a firmer ride too and consequently increase NVH slightly.

Oooh i mite grab those camber bolts

Have looked at that whiteline ALK. Some very interesting articles online but they get very technical...buggered if i can understand it lol. Talking about tyre contact pressure etc. I like your explanation better lol.

& a big thanks for all your help putting them in

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:39 am

Oops i got it wrong way around...should read:

Front camber: 0.02' (L) 0.05' (R)
Rear camber: 0.11' (L) 0.18' (R)

So i need camber adjustment bolts for the rear to make it neutral or slightly negative, & i'll still take those bolts for the front for a lil bit of neg camber...will help handling & reduce tyre wear on the outer edge

Venom · Post by **Venom** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:44 am

No worries. Bolts are sitting here, i can bring them along to Robe if you're not in a rush for them.

There's not a huge amount you can do for rear camber. It's a toe/camber adjustment in one which means you need to balance the two, and toe wins out for the adjustment that needs to be closest to specification. You can get adjustable arms but thats not cheap, and from what i've seen they're not entirely reliable (depending on brand/price). STi items may be longer so that could be worth investigating.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 4:46 pm

That would be great.

I'v done some looking. You can replace the bolts in front (lower) or rear (upper) with aftermarket camber bolts.

theres a really good tutorial for doing it. Just remember they are REDUCING camber in lowered cars, we're INCREASING camber in raised cars:

http://www.dirtyimpreza.com/forums/show ... php?t=6365
or
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthr ... ?t=1590221

Prices are funny. American eBay is around $22 + $14 postage, Oz is $77+, free postage!!!

There seems to be 2 types, both with lobes.
Whiteline with tabbed washer:
http://www.scoobytuner.com/products/?vA ... uctID=3108

H&R without tabbed washer:
http://www.scoobytuner.com/products/?vA ... uctID=3106

Wondering if anyone else has had experience with camber bolts...
(Maybe i should start a new thread...)

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Fri Oct 14, 2011 10:49 pm

Here's a few photos of the foz with raised springs:

Front:

Rear:

New Sump Guard

:

Just had to put the one of the bash plate in lol....ooh shiny lol

taza · Post by **taza** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:51 pm

Looks good mate, I reeally like the fender flares and the silver paint. As well as the metal nudgebar

You've got basically the same setup as me except I have1.5" more lift, slightly bigger Geolanders and 1" Subtle Solutions lift blocks.
Got the same bashplate too, had it for a month and its already got 2 cracks in it

Can't wait to see some vids of your beast in action

Taza

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 3:16 pm

That's the problem with cast alloy, no flex, we just bashed the crap out of mine with a sledge hammer to get it straight after it spending years on a rally car............and it only cost $50 lol.

taza · Post by **taza** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:48 pm

d_generate wrote:That's the problem with cast alloy, no flex, we just bashed the crap out of mine with a sledge hammer to get it straight after it spending years on a rally car............and it only cost $50 lol.

Yeah no flex at all. Oh well. I really just wanted it because it was airbag approved. If it cracks anymore I will just weld it up and in 4 years time when the cars not worth(7k or so) much I will go steel or thick alli.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:49 pm

taza wrote:Looks good mate, I reeally like the fender flares and the silver paint. As well as the metal nudgebar
You've got basically the same setup as me except I have1.5" more lift, slightly bigger Geolanders and 1" Subtle Solutions lift blocks.
Got the same bashplate too, had it for a month and its already got 2 cracks in it

Can't wait to see some vids of your beast in action

Taza

Where are the cracks? I noticed it doesnt fit very well, it hits against the nudge bar mounts, so i can imagine it getting cracks in the corners there. When i get home i'm gonna get the angle grinder to it lol

Also was bit disappointed its just not wide enough, doesnt go all the way to the rails so some of the wiring loom is exposed to sticks, rocks coming up

PS: its a standard plastic nudge bar

just the tray bit underneath is (thin) metal. thx tho. Yeah i like the fenders flares too

taza · Post by **taza** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:19 pm

I have a nudgebar too, didn't have it on for a while just for a bit of change but now do. Mine is all plastic and I wish it was partly metal like yours, gives it abit more of an aggressive look

My cracks are in the corners,where is changes angle, I gess you could call it where the bends are but the sumpgards are moulded not bent

If you get what I mean, they don't go all the way through the guard just abit on the inside if you take it off.
I wish mine was abit wider too, I have not problem trying to put it on other than it being a wierd shape and wieght when your laying under the car by yourself and trying to get the first bolt in.
If your not worried about insurance then take a grinder to it otherwise don't becuase as it says on the sticker on the sumpguard any modification voids the airbag safety thingy.

I still want to get rid of my front bumper completely because its all disformed, scrashed to death with almost no paint on it. I want a Subaxtreme bumper replacement bullbar. Maybe oneday though

Taza