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Hey all. I'm planning on getting myself a project car one day, probably not for a year or so since I need a garage to park it in and to have a garage I need a house...

So this is mostly wishful thinking right now, but I guess it gives me time to research things and wait for prices to come down.



So. What I want to do is convert a Brumby to electric. I've chosen a brumby for a few reasons. At first I was going to do a motorbike, but while that would be cheaper and easier it would require me to get a bike license and isn't very practical since I take my tools home each shift and all that. So I thought a small car would be good, but the tiny ones aren't practical either.

A Brumby isn't the most practical car, considering I have a wife and bub to cart around occasionally, but Mel has her own car (and I can do another conversion later on, really), and the Brumby has an added bonus of having a perfect place to install a generator later on for longer-range trips. They're also awesome.

So yeah. Electric Brumby. Maybe I can show Subaru how they should do their EV, rather than some dodgy looking Smartcar clone! hah.


These are the steps I've figured so far:
Stick it up on jackstands, remove the engine, gearbox, tailshaft, fuel tank and associated stuff, battery, alternator, ect - gut the thing, really.
Sell what bits I can.
Remove the wheels and hubs. Service bearings.
Install mounting brackets in engine bay for batteries and front engine/diff.
Buy two 3-phase induction motors, and a rear diff the same as the Brumby's one. (I could end up putting in two other diffs, depending on ratios)
Install one motor at the rear diff, and one motor at the front diff.
Remove most of the wiring save for perhaps the radio and lighting - depending on it's state and whether I need it or not - EVs have quite a bit less wiring than ICEmobiles.
Customise the dash (tacho to ammeter, fuel gauge to state-of-charge, probably temp to voltage)
Acquire (or build) an engine controller and a battery management system. (tricky and expensive)
Wire the car up for the batteries, BMS, EC, motors, and whatever else I've missed.
Install motor, BMS, EC.
Buy batteries (preferably LiFeP04, as they're much lighter but much more energy dense than lead/acid so the pack will be smaller and lighter but will give greater range. LiFeP04's are crazy expensive, though) and install them.
Get it registered.

At this point it'll be done, more or less, but like most project cars it won't be done by a long shot. I will sell my outback at this time to pay what I owe (swapping one loan for another, really), and use the fuel savings to pay that off while I plan the next stages. (most EVs cost about 3c/km, as opposed to 12c/km for my outback - they probably cost about 7c/km or so when you factor in the long term costs like replacement batteries (every 100,000km or so - more for fancier batteries).


After this I would like to lift it at least two inches, give it a 5-stud conversion and good offroad tyres. Install some kind of (diesel) generator in the tray for longer ranges and a good paint job. Diesel because I would be able to run it on veg oil, biodiesel, jet fuel, or anything else I want really - even diesel petroleum! :P What I'll end up with is a capable offroader with a long range that is cheap to run, and can be run on multiple fuel types.



Now most people would be asking "Why the hell would you do that when a good EJ25 would cost alot less!" Well, a few reasons. Firstly: It's not common, and it's a challenge. I've talked to alot of other people who have converted their cars to electricity and they all say it's great. (There's a Mustang in Armadale, a MightyBoy in Bussleton, a Suzuki tinything in the northern suburbs. Not to mention the people overseas - one guy in NZ just finished his conversion a month or so ago and has already saved $200 (over 500km)) I know for a fact that this configuration will work - there's a '95 Impreza in the USA that has been converted in this way, and is raced against similar petrol cars - and has won!

I'd also like to prove that an EV doesn't have to be the tiny hippy buzzbox that stumbles over a speed hump. Show those damn prius drivers what a real car can do! Though to be honest I'm mostly just sick of paying for godsdamned petrol every couple of weeks.

At some point in the future I'll probably end up doing another one for the missus. Hell, maybe I could make a business out of it - there's already one in Balcatta. But really I just want to do it for m'self.

So in a while I will be looking for a cheap Brumby with good bodywork and structure, but I won't really care what condition the engine or gearbox are in.

Woa. That's a pretty convoluted post.

sounds like an interesting little brumby.

i dont no to much on the workings of electric vehicles but it sounds like u got a good mindset bout what needs doing.

shall be interesting to see one day

woah...big plans..big ideas....big money.....i want to see it done!!!

maybe you can build one for me ...i wouldnt mind deleting fuel receipts down to a minimum

dave

Sounds like a good idea and will go well with a brumby. Make sure when you do start you take lots of pictures and keep us updated.......please

Woo encouragement! I have permission from the missus (in the form of "damnit you talk about this too much, you'd better do it" :P) so it's just a matter of time and interest rates.

And yes, I'll take many photos and videos and all that. I'll probably model the blog/website/whatever after kiwiev.com. And if Gav can do it, I can!

why not make a hybrid with a conventional motor and front wheel drive and an electric motor with rear wheel drive?

always willing to lend a hand. always wanted to work on a brumby

BrennyV wrote:always willing to lend a hand. always wanted to work on a brumby

I love them hey. The first one I worked on was Subarino's Brother's Brumby. We dropped the engine into it the day before the bbq last year

It was a good day, I found a new taste for subi grease

Bennie

yeh i have always had a thing for them. just dont think i can do the 2 seater thing

WOOP! Sounds like huge plans, good luck with it...
So when is the first real big step in doing this?

The first step is to pay off our current car loans, or at least one of them, so that the bank will give us the extra 100k to build our house...


Once the builders start their thing I'll start looking into brumbies on the market as well as all the bits I'll need. I'll probably just start off with the electric conversion alone - that'll cost enough as it is! And then later on I can get the lift kit, and the five-stud conversion and all that other stuff. Though that depends on the paycheck, perhaps I can afford to do it all at once since it'll be on stands for a few months anyway.


I'd love to buy the car now and start plodding along with it, but my car is parked on the front yard, since the garage is full of junk and we have four cars (living with my mum 'till we can afford to build the house), so I don't really have the space for it, sadly.

I got some info on some LiFePO4 batteries the other day from the australian distributor for Thundersky... crikey.


An 18kWh battery pack (weighing 192kg), made up of 64 3.2v, 90Ah batteries, will cost me a shade over $10,000!

That's pretty steep, but not as bad as I thought it would be. Hopefully once I'm actually in a position to start the conversion the price will have dropped a bit.

Of course the alternative is deep cycle lead/acid batteries, weighing up towards 700kg or more, having to double the capacity since to keep the batteries in good nick you have to not discharge below 50% or so, and even then will only last 2 or 3 years... ugh. I'd rather more expensive batteries that are much lighter and will last much longer.


I can get a BMS for a couple thousand, and the motors shouldn't cost much more than $2k, I hope. The motor controller will be pricey, though, unless I can figure something out.


Budget so far: $15,000! aie!

Can't wait to see this get off the ground...I got interested in this late last year too. I found a website from a couple of guys who'd done it to some little Diahatsu's.

There's a place in Balcatta that do conversions, can't remember their name though.


Phantom's thread about Outback vs Commonwhore fuel use really improved my mood about how much this is going to cost.

Using current petrol prices I've worked out that his five years of driving would cost $23,000, wheras the EV's charging cost would be $3,750 - or around $14,000 when you include the battery cost. And that's assuming fuel prices don't go up, I think they're expecting $2/L by the end of the year.

(still need a bloody house, though.

Great project, I've got something like this on my own list of future projects.

Something to keep in mind, to get it registered it needs to have the vacuum brake booster functioning and capable of 3 stops from 60km/h, so you'll need to factor in a vacuum pump and canister, I figured the pump would by controlled by a vacuum switch and only run when the canisters vacuum drops below a certain level.

I'm curious as to why you've chosen 3 phase motors? How would these run from a DC power source?

The electric projects I've seen use starter motors from a jet air craft, though where you get them I have no idea, don't remember seeing any last time I was at the wreckers.

The other thing I've noticed with electric vehicles is that because body shell and chassis are being used as the earth for significantly more current draw then normal, unless you're running dedicated earth wires which will increase your weight, the electrolysis effect draws from metal and causes it to rust very quickly, one car I know off was written off after about 2 years of daily driving because of extensive rust, so a sacrificial anode/cathode system of rust management would be worth looking into as well.

Keep us posted,
Jordan.

I'm not sure what I'm going to do with the brakes, I guess I'll try and commandeer the original brake system as best I can, but I'll get to that when I have the donor car.

I'm choosing 3-phase motors because they are more efficient, are easier to reverse, lower maintenance (since there's no brushes to wear out - only the bearings) and also they are easier to set up with regen braking - assuming the controller supports it.

And that's how they run on a DC source. The controller inverts the DC voltage into three AC waveforms, and controls the frequency and amplitude by the accelerator pedal setting.

Starter motors aren't usually a good choice for a traction motor, they're built for short bursts of power, and tend to overheat I think. That'd depend on the motor though.


I'm fairly sure that it's illegal to have an earth-return system for anything over 72 volts. Either way, I'll be having a return wire for the traction pack and the high power stuff, but the accessories will still be running on 12v so they can use the normal setup.


Of course this is all still up in the air, more or less. Until I actually buy the brumby. I saw a '92 model for $2000 in the paper last weekend! But I have nowhere to put it.

As far as I know you have to use the original brake system, including booster, but as I said it's only a matter of a vacuum pump and "storage" canister.

Sounds like you've well and truly researched the motor side of it

If you're going to that much effort and expense with the motors and controller(s) definitely go a little further for the regen braking, I've heard people say their biggest regret was not doing it when they had the chance.

The unit with the rust was a 72V system, which was well below the max power level of the starter motor used, meaning it could be used for longer periods with out over heating, but also adding to this is driving an EV is very different to driving a standard vehicle. Because the electric motors offer very little resistance when not powered you don't constantly hold you foot down to maintain speed, it's more a case of surge and coast, as a bonus this also extends your range.

Jordan.

Look into what a Diesel uses for supplyin Vacuum to brakes.

as they dont have any Vacuum in the Manifolds or something they have Vacuum servos to supply there braking efforts.

Thanks Matatak, I'll note that down. Surely a vacuum pump can't be too pricey - famous last words.

HAHA stupid Idea Alert.......


Vacuum Cleaner

Lol sorry instantly came to my mind