intake pipe source?

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hellVWrx
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intake pipe source?

Post by hellVWrx » Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:06 am

hiya

well i've just signed up here as i am fiddling with my race car and will have a few questions from time to time.

just pulled the EJ20 motor and i will need a new intake pipe from the turbo to the intercooler...........i'm running a liberty water/air intercooler and need this pipe in an upgraded material/strength as 29psi has blown the standard one.

anyone know where to source a newie, a web site or "good" ,lol, ebayer......any ideas on this problem appreciated

thanx

Daimo

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Gannon
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Post by Gannon » Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:31 am

Hey Damien, i was just writing you an email with some info about that pipe.

This is the cheapest way to replace that hose. Costs around $40
It comprises of a bend and a straight piece of silicone, a short length of steel pipe and hoseclamps to join them
I bought my silicone from http://www.enthaily.com/welcome/page42.php

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Ditch the factory BOV (valve thing that normally connects to the 3/4" hose) i dare say that it would be leaking at 29psi. Its spring simply isnt strong enough.
Buy an aftermarket Blow Off Valve, they have adjustable spring pressure and they give that wanky Whoooosh noise on every gear change.

Oh and Welcome to AUSubaru!
Current rides: 2016 Mitsubishi Triton GLS & 2004 Forester X
Ongoing Project/Toy: 1987 RX Turbo EA82T, Speeduino ECU, Coil-pack ignition, 440cc Injectors, KONI adjustale front struts, Hybrid L Series/ Liberty AWD 5sp
Past rides: 92 L series turbo converted wagon, 83 Leone GL Sedan, 2004 Liberty GT Sedan & 2001 Outback
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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Sat Apr 05, 2008 9:05 am

oooorkay, thanx Gannon

at the mo............

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BrennyV
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Post by BrennyV » Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:03 pm

29psi on a rs lib waic? u might want to upgrade to a larger waic unit.
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Gannon
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Post by Gannon » Sat Apr 05, 2008 1:17 pm

BrennyV wrote:u might want to upgrade to a larger waic unit
Agreed!

These are supposed to be good, but a little pricey.
PWR Water to Air Barrel Intercooler
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Im sure Jeff has the skills to fabricate something similar
Current rides: 2016 Mitsubishi Triton GLS & 2004 Forester X
Ongoing Project/Toy: 1987 RX Turbo EA82T, Speeduino ECU, Coil-pack ignition, 440cc Injectors, KONI adjustale front struts, Hybrid L Series/ Liberty AWD 5sp
Past rides: 92 L series turbo converted wagon, 83 Leone GL Sedan, 2004 Liberty GT Sedan & 2001 Outback
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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Sat Apr 05, 2008 3:23 pm

yeah, your right, there is one there to upgrade too.

i guess it's worked fine so far........we have 200KW at the wheels.

like all our cars, when do you stop? i guess if i have to get some silicon pipe for this, i may as well re do it with the new intercooler. i will get some pictures of the newie early next week.

yes, PWR barrel coolers are very cool and work extremely well, a friend runs one.

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Post by discopotato03 » Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:12 am

Matter of opinion but 29 pounds of boost and 200 ATW KW - from 2L ?
I think it would be VERY easy to make more power with a lot less boost and be easier on all the componentry .

One of the better closed throttle recirculation valves you'll find is the factory Skyline GTR one's , its actually two ganged together to vent a lot of air quickly on an angry RB26 .

Cheers A .

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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:49 am

yeah, i'm not sure what output to expect.....

stocko motor other than turbo, injectors and ecu.........sorta keeps the costs down, then you can ring the *$%^ out of it without worrying bout big $$$ slamming.................but yes i also understand the build it tough the fir$t time phillosophy. fuel cuts at 8500rpm, keep in mind it only does a couple of hours work every few years (hillclimb & circuit racing)..........that's racing for ya! i'm thinking the drift days held just up the road are looking very tempting tho

damn i wished i hadn't signed up here, i feel some mods coming on!

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Gannon
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Post by Gannon » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:56 am

With a few mods, there is no reason you should not be able to make 200kW at 20psi

Here are some examples from the guys at RS Liberty Club.com

RSLC TOP TEN POWER FIGURES
Current rides: 2016 Mitsubishi Triton GLS & 2004 Forester X
Ongoing Project/Toy: 1987 RX Turbo EA82T, Speeduino ECU, Coil-pack ignition, 440cc Injectors, KONI adjustale front struts, Hybrid L Series/ Liberty AWD 5sp
Past rides: 92 L series turbo converted wagon, 83 Leone GL Sedan, 2004 Liberty GT Sedan & 2001 Outback
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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:18 pm

ooorkay, for simplicity alone i might stick to the standard recirc style blo off.........will for sure look for a GTR one tho, thanx!could i run it between the throttle body and the intercooler as i already have some steel tube there i could plump it into? this way i could have a one piece silicon elbow from turbo up to intercooler

what is the difference between the denso there now and say an aftermarket one that vents straight out? they both do the same job, just different capacity or ? does one help avoid lag more?

whats the exact concern with running the liberty WAIC @ 29 psi? have i been lucky to blo the up pipe rather than the intercooler?

sorry for all the beginner questions, no newie to engine builds, but new to BOOST!............mmmmm boooost {drool}

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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:45 pm

these the ones to upgrade to?

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Gannon
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Post by Gannon » Sun Apr 06, 2008 6:30 pm

hellVWrx wrote:for simplicity alone i might stick to the standard recirc style blo off, could i run it between the throttle body and the intercooler?
If you are running aftermarket engine management, and you no longer have a MAF, there is no need to run a recirculating BOV. They only recirculate to stop the ECU with a MAF from becoming confused

There is no reason you cant run a BOV from the IC to TB pipe.
hellVWrx wrote: what is the difference between the denso there now and say an aftermarket one that vents straight out?
The denso's spring probably isnt holding up to 29psi and most likely is leaking and wasting boost. An aftermarket one has an adjustable spring
hellVWrx wrote: whats the exact concern with running the liberty WAIC @ 29 psi? have i been lucky to blo the up pipe rather than the intercooler?
With the amount of airflow at 29psi, the liberty WAIC (which only has a 2" inlet) is going to be imparting a bit of a restriction and costing you HP
Current rides: 2016 Mitsubishi Triton GLS & 2004 Forester X
Ongoing Project/Toy: 1987 RX Turbo EA82T, Speeduino ECU, Coil-pack ignition, 440cc Injectors, KONI adjustale front struts, Hybrid L Series/ Liberty AWD 5sp
Past rides: 92 L series turbo converted wagon, 83 Leone GL Sedan, 2004 Liberty GT Sedan & 2001 Outback
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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:16 am

ended up finding a samco hose over here...........

http://rallynuts.com/motorsport/SAMCO_H ... )_1460.asp

are there any schematic drawings of the denso BOV around?

looking through the spares, i imagine this silver intercooler is same specs as the black one, just different model?..........

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still tossing up on wether to go to bigger, custom waic........

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Gannon
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Post by Gannon » Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:26 am

That link doesnt work, (one too many [url]http://)[/url] but http://rallynuts.com/motorsport/SAMCO_H ... )_1460.asp does

The silver waic is from the Jap spec RS Legacy. I dunno if it has any performance gains, but it appears to have some kind of sensor, most likely a temperature sensor.

If by schematic you mean what the pipes connect to...

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Be cool, go the bigger, custom waic!
Current rides: 2016 Mitsubishi Triton GLS & 2004 Forester X
Ongoing Project/Toy: 1987 RX Turbo EA82T, Speeduino ECU, Coil-pack ignition, 440cc Injectors, KONI adjustale front struts, Hybrid L Series/ Liberty AWD 5sp
Past rides: 92 L series turbo converted wagon, 83 Leone GL Sedan, 2004 Liberty GT Sedan & 2001 Outback
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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:32 am

thanx Gannon, was more looking for the inner workings of the denso itself tho. it appears they close the air flow by rotating perpendicular to the air travel, rather than lift up like a household water tap.........which has got me thinking that the more boost would actually hold the "gate" closed?...........anyways got hold of some skyline ones to play with, but also trawling for a big turbosmart too.

can't complain about the service from "rallynuts".............7 days and it's sitting here ready to go......pics later.

will also make a stainless "up pipe", without bung to run either the skylines or tbosmrt between IC and TB

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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Fri May 23, 2008 6:37 am

just a quick update as i don't think unfinished threads are much fun for anyone:cool:.......

the turbo to IC pipe was sorted.............

so i've been quietly achieving progress on this machine, with an aim of just having it in storage , "race ready", for whenever the opportunity arises............

with the flywheel refitted and new clutch in place, the motor was ready to go back in. the bellhousing was cleaned up, necessary's greased (throw out bearing pivots, guide etc) and new thrust bearing (german) installed.

the standard liberty pipe from turbo to intercooler was long since blown apart, repaired track side, but never replaced. there was no way i could leave it. so a few options were sorted, as it's nice to arrive at race meets far from home with spares at hand...........

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to avoid reinventing the wheel at this point, it has gone back together as it was previosly run. the samco model specific hose (wrx) will allow the use of standard recirulatory style blow off valve.

in the future, we have the option of going to a aftermarket BOV which can be plumbed into either the stainless "up" pipe or the one from the intercooler to T.B

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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Fri May 23, 2008 6:41 am

so here is where i'm at now..............note the "workshop manual" taped to the back window a picture says a thousand words............and people wonder why i do boring threads with too many pictures, but for sure they come in mighty handy


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the original reason for engine pull was the fried clutch which was also sorted


flywheel has survived the ordeal ok and resurfacing will be fine

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took some measurments of the new clutch and pressure plate to compare to the old set up..........flywheel will be ground to provide maximum clamp force by adjusting pressure plate height relative to the clutch plate surface

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flywheel will be removed and "ground"..........to remove hardened hot spots and uneven surface.

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we estimated the standard 228mm pressure plate and clutch had done only two hours work:but that's solid HARD work! (several years of racing)........very sticky tyres, tall 1st gear, shirt loads of torque + horsepower and not enough clamp force, combined with a total lack of mechanical sympathy........results in a little bit of heat

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undoubtedly the replacement will last much longer........


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clamp force will be over three times as much on previous set up...........

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you can see the lip near the ring gear (pressure plate seat)
is also ground to keep the height correct.

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hellVWrx
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Post by hellVWrx » Fri May 23, 2008 11:31 pm

RUNNING AGAIN

soo basically it all went back together fine. a couple of re arangments because of the new pipes, but nothing spectacular


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went to start it and no fuel pressure at the engine. so the process of elimination lead us to the primary efi fuel pump which was seized probably due to "gumming" of residue fuel after the last run..........anyways got that sorted (not easy) and so it was time to fire up.



anyways, try this link for a video as i do the run around looking for leaks and noises having just got it fired up for the first time in 18 months.................damn sound has got me amped now i'm pretty chuffed with the results!

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jzk25
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Post by jzk25 » Sat May 24, 2008 11:03 am

No bolt on turbo for a subaru is going to be any use at 29psi. Looks like you have an MY01 engine but I can't make out the turbo. Looks like a VFxx from the actuator though. Depending on the exhaust housing size it will only be good for 23psi at most, that's for the biggest nugget(VF22). All you will be doing at 29psi is churning up heat and damaging the turbo(and inevitably engine) for no reason. You will make more power at the turbos efficiency peak which will be 18-23psi depending on the specific trim of the turbo.
This is just FYI, I am not trying to attack you or anything.
I'm sure the car is devestatingly fast anyway but pumping boost in does not equal more power if it is out of efficiency.

The waic will really be struggling at anything above 15psi anyway, they are just not designed to flow that much air.
The silver and black cores are the same except for the water level sensor.
Cheer. Al.

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Gannon
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Post by Gannon » Sat May 24, 2008 12:04 pm

Lookin good Damio

Ya will have to grab me next time you go out there so i can have a bow-peep
Current rides: 2016 Mitsubishi Triton GLS & 2004 Forester X
Ongoing Project/Toy: 1987 RX Turbo EA82T, Speeduino ECU, Coil-pack ignition, 440cc Injectors, KONI adjustale front struts, Hybrid L Series/ Liberty AWD 5sp
Past rides: 92 L series turbo converted wagon, 83 Leone GL Sedan, 2004 Liberty GT Sedan & 2001 Outback
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