dual range, behind ej20g clutch, box info

woody.t · Post by **woody.t** » Mon Oct 31, 2011 6:32 pm

im going to put the ej20g i have infront of the current dual range in the liberty and maybe have an l-series dual range and larger 5th gear put in by a mates dad.. brings me to my questions..?
1. What clutch ? can you convert the dual range box to a hydraulic set up? or will a heavy duty for the 2.2 be adequate with the cable pull? i don't want to end up with the left leg killing clutches i've felt in some l-series with the conversion and if not what have other people done, are the rs boxes rubbish off-road..
2. liberty with l-series low range? how long will it last with oil feeders put into pump on to low/high range?
3. A front lsd anything around that would go into the dual range?? would be good with a centre diff-lock from an all-wheel drive box and a rear lsd ... it's just a thought..anyone seen anything like this? don't some of the sti box have a front lsd..?
4. if not liberty dual range what other box would you recommend keeping in mind ill do a bit of four wheel driving but still want to use it as a daily drive

everyone is more then welcome to chuck in their 5 cents

cheers

legacytt · Post by **legacytt** » Mon Oct 31, 2011 8:15 pm

I have the box you describe and it is now behind an H6 in an Outback. I used to have it behind an Ej20t running a VF28 etc etc. All will be fine as long as you drive sensibly. I stripped teeth off second gear by towing a trailer that was too heavy, similarly if you launch too hard you would damage teeth on the dual range setup. I am using a Jim Berry heavy duty push clutch, when used with a cable it was quite a heavy pedal and did result in one clutch fork bending. I am now using a hydralic clutch acutator from a gen 3 RX Liberty along with the matching fork. To get this to work on the earlier case (mine is a Gen 1 Dual Range with L series Low) I had to move the pivot point. The hole is there for it, you just need to tap the hole to make the right thread. Simialrly on the case there is one hole for the bolts that hold the slave cylinder in place and I drilled a second and tapped accordingly. This has worked fine, athough it could be better for selecting reverse so I suspect the slave could be moved a little closer to the fork. I am not sure if you can fit a front LSD to these and not sure if it would be worth it. I have the DCCD centre and that is a great setup, you can get these off the WRX STI RA close ratio boxes, you just swap the whole rear transfer and the wiring is a seperate loom that just needs a ground and 12v. Best to get the factory contoller and thumb wheel.

RSR 555 · Post by **RSR 555** » Tue Nov 01, 2011 1:34 am

woody.t wrote:1. What clutch ? can you convert the dual range box to a hydraulic set up? or will a heavy duty for the 2.2 be adequate with the cable pull? i don't want to end up with the left leg killing clutches i've felt in some l-series with the conversion and if not what have other people done, are the rs boxes rubbish off-road..

RPM clutch from Clutch Industries.. available from Perth Brake and Clutch. You can convert to hydraulic if you use an EJ box with the slave cylinder mounting points. The RPM clutch will handle the EJ22 or EJ20T. I'll be using the D/R behind mine but I'm not planning on doing any Ken Block style driving.

woody.t wrote:2. liberty with l-series low range? how long will it last with oil feeders put into pump on to low/high range?

Oil feeders put in? sounds like a lot of expense. Just look after the box and it will look after you. Just use good quality oil and change it more often.

woody.t wrote:3. A front lsd anything around that would go into the dual range?? would be good with a centre diff-lock from an all-wheel drive box and a rear lsd ... it's just a thought..anyone seen anything like this? don't some of the sti box have a front lsd..?

Chat to Tom (d_gen) as he put the front LSD in and is happy with it. Don't know if there's such a thing as a good AWD diff, unless you're going to go 12 or 20kg (8kg is a waste of time IMO). Rear LSD is always a good idea but hard to get good ones.

woody.t wrote:4. if not liberty dual range what other box would you recommend keeping in mind ill do a bit of four wheel driving but still want to use it as a daily drive

They put the D/R behind the EJ25 so like I say.. just look after it.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:25 pm

RSR 555 wrote:Don't know if there's such a thing as a good AWD diff, unless you're going to go 12 or 20kg (8kg is a waste of time IMO). Rear LSD is always a good idea but hard to get good ones.

Please explain....

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:54 pm

RSR 555 wrote:Oil feeders put in? sounds like a lot of expense. Just look after the box and it will look after you. Just use good quality oil and change it more often.

A good idea to do if you've got the gearbox apart - all you do is drill and tap a hole above each low range gear cog, put in a barbed pipe piece, a T bar between the two of these, get a carbie fuel pump (these pump ANYTHING that's liquid!), tap a hole in the back of the gearbox, apparently there's an unused bolt hole that can be drilled and tapped to place the pick up line in, mount the pump near here and wire it in. Done.

It's a good idea as your low range gears starve of oil as you do long steep hill climbs, Ruby Scoo's low range starts to whine as I climb hills now

It's relatively cheap to do, but I'd recommend having the gearbox apart to properly clean up the metal shavings.

nachaluva wrote:Please explain....

Ok pauline

The kg rating is for the centre diff and is basically a load rating before the centre LSD starts to slip. 5-8kg is standard, 12kg I think is a rally special that's pretty much custom built and the 20kg is in some STi's but is rather harsh to drive with, that's why the rally boys run with the 12kg centre.

That's how I understand it about the rally stuff...

Cheers

Bennie

woody.t · Post by **woody.t** » Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:28 am

i meant a diff lock that just switches open centre to close... think they're in vortex or leone awd's rather then a higher weight centre lsd... a DCCD sounds like it would be a good option but i'd say ill be saving my pennies for a while, anyone know what a set-up would go for?? and i've been keeping my eye out for an lsd but nothing as of yet

guyph_01 · Post by **guyph_01** » Thu Nov 03, 2011 1:58 am

RSR 555 wrote:RPM clutch from Clutch Industries.. available from Perth Brake and Clutch. You can convert to hydraulic if you use an EJ box with the slave cylinder mounting points. The RPM clutch will handle the EJ22 or EJ20T. I'll be using the D/R behind mine but I'm not planning on doing any Ken Block style driving.

I bought a converted Lib wagon a while back that Paul had put back the engine together for me and it had a D/R box. Clutch would always slipped. Although it was a std clutch! the best thing would be to get a clutch made like Scott used to do. behind my EJ25 i went with the same clutch Paul used behind his turbo engine. It did smell a bit the time we went to red hill but i think it due to the fact that i don't have a hand brake yet on my car:(

guyph_01 · Post by **guyph_01** » Thu Nov 03, 2011 2:06 am

woody.t wrote:i meant a diff lock that just switches open centre to close... think they're in vortex or leone awd's rather then a higher weight centre lsd... a DCCD sounds like it would be a good option but i'd say ill be saving my pennies for a while, anyone know what a set-up would go for?? and i've been keeping my eye out for an lsd but nothing as of yet

Well i bought my DCCD for $400 posted, big thx to H-Top as i never saw one that cheap again. I then had to buy the controller for another $300. I know STechnicb want about $600-800 for a DCCD.

I've got one of those vortex center diff lock gearbox your looking for. Will soon be for sale as i'll be using a Ej box and won't need it as its gonna be a street car. I think the last diff lock box that sold over east i remember was about $800 and they are kinda easier to find there. I remember when i was looking for one a guy here was gonna strip his car and wanted like $1200 for his diff lock box, his name starts with a d i think.....

hope that helps
Again you never know and might just buy a green vortex with that box for $100:D except it might be 2wd...., I kinda miss her. was a good car...

woody.t · Post by **woody.t** » Fri Nov 04, 2011 2:28 am

yeh dccd sounds like it might be a go-er i sent s-technic an e-mail to see what they can sort out unless someone on here can sort one for me.. might pass on the front lsd looking at prices though but a rear is definately on the cards... wouldnt mind i bigger 5th gear as 3000rpm at 100km/h seems excessive for a turbo engine but i suppose some bigger tyres will sort that out for me aswell

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Fri Nov 04, 2011 5:57 pm

I got my as new DCCD for $380 & we'll make a 0 - 12v variable switch for it from J Car for a few dollars hopefully. I think Guy & I both arsed it on price though.

Front mechanical diff is around $440 delivered to your door from the US if you offer them around $335...mine works great.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/OBX-JDM-Helical ... 23158f3111

I'm using a 3,000lb clutch out of an 08> WRX, in my EJ20G with a 91 Lib d/r box, they changed the direction the hydraulics push that year but it was a pain to set up so we went cable, not heavy at all, actually pretty much the same as the h/d 2,500lb hydraulic one in my STI set up but I do carry a spare cable just in case. The std 2L is around 2,000lb from memory.

Gannon · Post by **Gannon** » Fri Nov 04, 2011 6:31 pm

Ive got a DR box behind my EJ20G in my RX. Using a stock liberty clutch and flywheel, but the flywheel has a step machined in it to increase the clamping force. Haven't driven it yet to see if it works though

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Fri Nov 04, 2011 8:04 pm

Has anyone explored Centreforce clutches?

http://www.centerforce.com/clutches.tpl ... chselector

I had 1 in an RX3 with ~230-240KW, was way lighter than the clutch that was in it before & will NEVER slip!

It uses tiny little weights on cams that push the pressure plate in harder the faster it spins...simple yet effective!

I used to laugh so hard at all these idiots thats would use mega heavy solid clutches that were so heavy they'd get dead leg after a while lol. plus they'd drive like a dog with fleas haha.

The centreforce clutch feels standard but has the performance better than an uber heavy duty...seriously have a look before you decide which way to go

Yarran · Post by **Yarran** » Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:46 pm

d_generate wrote:
Front mechanical diff is around $440 delivered to your door from the US if you offer them around $335...mine works great.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/OBX-JDM-Helical ... 23158f3111

is this front lsd a straight swap in the EA82 dual range box?

Post by **TOONGA** » Mon Sep 16, 2013 7:52 pm

Yarran wrote:is this front lsd a straight swap in the EA82 dual range box?

not really as it would depend on if the diff was male or female and what CVs the axles stubs take if it is a male version.

TOONGA

Yarran · Post by **Yarran** » Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:59 pm

TOONGA wrote:not really as it would depend on if the diff was male or female and what CVs the axles stubs take if it is a male version.

TOONGA

Thanks TOONGA makes sense, ill have to keep reserching

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:13 pm

Yarran wrote:is this front lsd a straight swap in the EA82 dual range box?

Yes it will drop in without too many issues - that diff looks like it would drop straight in and clear the low range gearset as well.

You would need a set of MPFI touring wagon drive shafts or a set of RX turbo units that are the same.

I used an OBX helical diff in my gearbox, it had to be ground down on one end to clear the L series low range. I've heard the OBX diff is a real nasty cast but a good diff that can be made better by pulling it apart and taking care to ground down any casing marks, making sure all the washers are in good condition and tensioning the bolts to the same torque all round.

I'm sure the crown wheel will bolt straight up, I don't know if they changed the bolt patterns on these between models.

Cheers

Bennie

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dual range, behind ej20g clutch, box info

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