#4 cylinder missing

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 5:15 pm

Right, got another problem with the MY

It's cylinder #4, it has been on and off for ages but now it just wont fire at all. It hurts to hear her sounding so sick and the exhaust smelling like straight petrol

Anyway, like I said it had been on and off for a long time, sometimes it would be fine and others it wouldn't. Which lead me to believe there could be a break inside the spark lead? the plug looks fine I think. Has anyone else had this sort of problem in an EA81? Dad reckons it could be a bit more serious like a stuck valve due to the oil getting too low at one point.

The previous owner (my brother) didn't care for the car at all, he neglected it far too much which is why the engine had to be replaced once (he didn't check the coolant and the head got cracked or something I can't remember exactly) but he also didn't check the oil often enough, dad checked it one day and it was off the chart low. Could this have stuffed up the valves? it was about a year or so ago.

Right now I'll see if we can get a new lead to see if it's that, put some Morey's upper cylinder lube in (who knows it might help) and see what happens.

Any suggestions I'm sure would do nothing but help, but if the problem is something that needs the engine out to fix, it would probably spell the end for this car; dad doesn't want to spend a whole lot on it, and I'm out of work so have zilcho to spend on it

Cheers,
Sam

1111giles · Post by **1111giles** » Wed Sep 15, 2010 7:44 pm

Hey Sam,
The first (& ultimately most cost effective) thing to do first is to pressure test the cylinder (s).
This way you get an idea of where you need to be looking for the problem.

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 9:59 am

Swap the lead with another cylinder that runs same length HT lead (cap to spark plug) to see if you can shift the problem to another cylinder. Then as Giles says comp test and was it you that just found tight valve causing a cylinder to drop out? If not, check valve clearances.

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:03 pm

I'd also pull the rocker cover off and manually push all valves. This is a regular start process for the 29 chev, its easy to do but could be a little tricky in the MY's engine bay.

Other than that check the Dizzy cap for worn contacts on cylinder 4. I've also seen a spark lead burnt through so that at idle and light loads all is good but as soon as it was under load all kinds of nasty things happened. Swapped the lead and it was all good.

Also if you've added any overflow bottles, check to see where the coolant is sprayed when working under some high heat. I say this as we had a brumby on a 4wd session that would stall halfway up some decent climbs due to cylinder 4 dropping out. On closer inspection it was the aftermarket over flow bottle that happened to be squirting coolant over no4 plug causing it to drop out of service. Moved the overflow pipe and all was good!

All the best with it. I'm sure it will be a simple problem to sort out. And hammer your bro for not looking after a great little car. He should be more responsible than that, particularly if he knew this car was being passed on to you!

Cheers

Bennie

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:36 pm

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone, I'll get around to trying them all sooner or later

How do I get the cylinders pressure tested? Does the car have to go to a garage or can you do it with one of those gauges you see at supercheap?

Steptoe, I swapped the leads over and there was no difference, so that's the faulty lead idea out. As I was looking through the service manual looking for ideas (troubleshooting etc) I came across spark plugs page with all the pictures of different problems and decided to have another look. #4s plug was covered in oil, as well as the one next to it, which the book says is a valve problem, so looks like a pressure test has to be done.

El freddo, the contacts in the distributor are all ok, and we haven't put any overflow bottles in, not really sure what they are hehe

Also next week dad said we'll change the oil (needs it anyway) as well as have a look under the rocker cover, adjust some things (not sure exactly what he said he kinda trailed off lol)

cheers,
Sam

wrxer · Post by **wrxer** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:52 pm

no point changing oil as you may have to drop it anyway.
could try swapping spark plug with another one to eliminate that as well.
yes, get a super cheap tester and check compression, if you get one that can screqw in then you can do it yourself

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Fri Sep 17, 2010 10:28 am

sound like a plug issue to me and oily not always valves to me more valve stem seals or rings. New plugs leads cap and rotor won't cost you too much to do yourself. Use a high dtergent oil meant for Diesel engines may help clean out rings.

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Fri Sep 17, 2010 10:28 am

a hotter range spark plug too helps combat oiled up plugs

1111giles · Post by **1111giles** » Sat Sep 18, 2010 7:18 am

If the pressure test confirms down pressure then you are going to have to at very least do the heads / valves, whilst you have the heads off - you can check the bores if worn or scored then its a strip and bore / rebuild, unless you opt to change for another lump.
I had an EA81 which was down pressure on rear off side cyl. Pressure test found it out as the engine was lumpy running at low revs. Ok though at high revs.
Turned out to be water had got in and rusted the bore (engine had stood for 4 or 5 years)
You can get a FULL engine gasket set and if required all the rings pistons shells for a rebuild from westendengineparts in the US of A.
I got a gasket set from them it has the lot inc valve seals for about USD 65 plus delivery. Buckets cheaper than genuine Subaru parts and perfectly acceptable quality.
Best of luck with it anyway....

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Sat Sep 18, 2010 2:49 pm

1111giles wrote:If the pressure test confirms down pressure then you are going to have to at very least do the heads / valves, whilst you have the heads off - you can check the bores if worn or scored then its a strip and bore / rebuild, unless you opt to change for another lump.
I had an EA81 which was down pressure on rear off side cyl. Pressure test found it out as the engine was lumpy running at low revs. Ok though at high revs.
Turned out to be water had got in and rusted the bore (engine had stood for 4 or 5 years)
You can get a FULL engine gasket set and if required all the rings pistons shells for a rebuild from westendengineparts in the US of A.
I got a gasket set from them it has the lot inc valve seals for about USD 65 plus delivery. Buckets cheaper than genuine Subaru parts and perfectly acceptable quality.
Best of luck with it anyway....

Hmm that seems like a big job to me (strip, bore and rebuild) and like I said first post if it is something real major, it will probably be the end of the car

We're going to to the pressure test on mon/wed or tuesday, turns out we already had a pressure tester lying around

So I'm really hoping it doesn't need a rebore and rebuild.

The odd thing about all this is, it was running fine a matter of weeks ago, before my bro got his new subie he was driving this thing across adelaide and back every day to get to work with no problems at all. Now it has just sat under the car port for a few weeks with a few startups (but no proper driving) could the bores get scored or rings worn out just like that? Plus the engine was overhauled before it was installed in this car a few years ago, I thought wear like this comes from many years of wear?

Anyway like I said, pressure test early this week and we're gonna have a good look and a fiddle hehe

But I'm really hoping against hope it won't need a rebore

cheers
sam

Mick2642 · Post by **Mick2642** » Sat Sep 18, 2010 10:09 pm

Believe it or not, I had exactly the same problem with the same symptoms with an MY wagon running an EA81 (cheap parts car/paddock-basher) and it was fixed by replacing the lead and spark plug. The lead was an old spare I found in the back of the shed and the spark plug was an old one I took out of the Scoob (the car I am actually doing up).

When I replaced the plugs on my car, I decided to keep the old ones. They are NGK BP6ES sparkies. Now the paddock basher runs sweet.

Cheers, Mick. (Hoping that a dead sparkie and/or ignition lead is all that's wrong with yours).

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 5:29 pm

Well, once again, it was the simplest possible answer which was the right one

Turns out the #4 spark plug was faulty, oh and the exhaust valve clearance was out by a couple of thou.

We checked all the clearances first on all cylinders, and only #4 exhaust was out. So we put that right, put it back together, started it up and all 4 were firing, but #4 was intermittently dropping out (like if you wiggled the lead it would drop out, come back etc). we pulled the plug and it looked ok, but to be sure we swapped it with a new one and hey what do you know, she runs smooth as

No one was more surprised than dad though, he said he's never had to change a plug on any car because it was worn/broken hehe

So that was that and we changed the oil and oil filter (the old oil was about as dirty as it comes lol) and now she purrs like the proverbial and is wisper quiet (quite a change from what is was).

So once again, thanks for all the tips everyone and once again, it was the simplest answer. One day when I get the money, a new set of leads and plugs are first on the list (and maybe a hotter coil or something

)

Cheers,
sam

wrxer · Post by **wrxer** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:50 pm

dont replace them now, wait till they stuffed and replace them on a needs basis, one ata time

phillatdarwin · Post by **phillatdarwin** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:33 pm

wrxer wrote:dont replace them now, wait till they stuffed and replace them on a needs basis, one ata time

i like your way just like my way fix it when it brakes

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:33 pm

I do mine the other way - preventative. Oil and filter change at 10,000km intervals - easy to remember when done when odometer does its 10,000 , 230,000, 240,000 etc no need for lube stickers or dates on filters, the tight tars in me also changes engines over near the 10,000 mark to save on oils

When I can't recal the last time I did plugs leads and dizzy cap I do them as well. Reckon if you get 50,000km good service renew them to save these sort of life interuptions we have now due to crap plugs and valve clearances.

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Tue Sep 21, 2010 12:10 am

steptoe wrote:I do mine the other way - preventative. Oil and filter change at 10,000km intervals - easy to remember when done when odometer does its 10,000 , 230,000, 240,000 etc no need for lube stickers or dates on filters, the tight tars in me also changes engines over near the 10,000 mark to save on oils When I can't recal the last time I did plugs leads and dizzy cap I do them as well. Reckon if you get 50,000km good service renew them to save these sort of life interuptions we have now due to crap plugs and valve clearances.

Yeah dad was reminiscing

about the first engine this car had, he changed the oil every 10,000, did like it said to in the book, really looked after it for 20 years. Only took my brother 3 years to wreck it

but oh well, thats in the past now hey

1111giles · Post by **1111giles** » Tue Sep 21, 2010 3:20 am

Hey - Good news eh? Simple and cheap scooby fix

Now you can enjoy the drive ehehehe!