2010 Diesel Drivetrain shudder

[Falco80]

Recommendation is now to keep the revs somewhere around 2000rpm (give or take). But this leaves you open to the dreaded shudder. Did you receive revised shift points?

On the Forester the shift points were (indicated km/h) 24, 40, 64, 72, 80. This was revised to 24, 40, 65, 85, 105. Hence asking you to do ~80km/h in 4th.

I travel 200Km's on the highway for 4 or 5 days of the week and i pretty much don't use 6th gear. If i'm driving normally i upshift at 3000rpm and downshift at 2000rpm. You have to remember also that the speedo is waaaay out, as 100km/h indicated on the speedo is like 92km/h actual speed on GPS. I only drop it into 6th if i'm doing 120km/h on the speedo, which is just over 110km/h actual speed. I keep the engine spinning between 2000-3000rpm and don't have any issues. You need to rev these engines, lugging them around is not doing yourself any favours. If your in the city you need to take it for a hard fast run periodically with the engine maintaining a decent speed for a prolonged period. Sometimes i'll drive the 100km's home in 4th gear, engine doing 3000rpm's the whole way on cruise control. Economy doesn't change.

[MY11OBD]

Hi Dan, what is your averge economy?
seems though you travel quite a lot of kms each day/week.
in comparison to some you are doing 5 times more... would you think driving the car harder in say someone that uses city roads and travels
roughly 50km per day make and difference,since in city driving there is constant stop start and never much chance of being able to achieve 80km/he on 4th gear for at least 15-20mins...

[Falco80]

Hi Dan, what is your averge economy?
seems though you travel quite a lot of kms each day/week.
in comparison to some you are doing 5 times more... would you think driving the car harder in say someone that uses city roads and travels
roughly 50km per day make and difference,since in city driving there is constant stop start and never much chance of being able to achieve 80km/he on 4th gear for at least 15-20mins...

My economy over the last 57000k's averages around 6-6.5 litres per hundred. Some weeks I drive for economy and others I give it a good flogging. I don't take that figure off the vehicles readout, I calculate that from actual km's travelled each tank with the GPS (which is always around 20k's more than the trip-meter in the car) and the litres of fuel I filled up with. I use the same servo close to home and fill it to the brim everytime.

In my opinion if your in the city then this is the wrong engine for you. Whatever Subaru tells buyers, it's just to get sales and move cars out the door. If your thrashing it in the city all your doing is clogging the DPF faster and the poor old thing never gets a chance to do proper regen because of all the stop-start traffic.

[ahum]

Hey guys

My 2010 Diesel Forester has developed the shudder of doom in the last couple of months.

First trip back to the dealer I went for a drive with one of the techs and got the impression he'd seen it before. He updated the computer but that did nothing. Second trip back they said they wanted to change the glow plugs (what does that have to do with anything since all they do is assist with starting the engine) but didn't have any in stock so back again this week for that to happen.

In the mean time I have this morning unplugged what I assume was the EGR unit as per eems post. This caused the check engine and traction control warning lights to come on but the engine was smoother than ever but has limited power as the turbo won't kick in (I assume this is because the engine warning lights has put the car into limp home mode). Plugged the EGR back in and instantly back to coughing and shuddering and generally a terrible drive.

Going to tell the dealer to give me a loan car and not to bother giving mine back until it is fixed properly.

Edit: Just spoke to the dealer about getting a loan car and asked why they wanted to change the glow plugs. Short answer is they don't but need to remove them to get at the real problem and wanted spares in stock in case the got broken (apparently they are a pain in the ass to remove).

[wbj]

ahum, how many k's on the clock? Have you had any issues with the dpf?

[skipalami]

Had my MAP sensor cleaned at 50000km. It looked like a brick when it was removed with all of the caked on carbon matter.

Car ran a whole lot better after that. Its coming on 12 months with no door rattling shudders.

Ahum, make sure you avoid supermarket chain related Diesel, its basically rubbish. I use BP or CALTEX Vortex Diesel ONLY. This made a huge difference in the shudder resolution.

[ahum]

So picked up the car yesterday and the dealer telling me it was fixed. Less than 200m down the road and shudder shudder shudder even in third gear. I would have went straight back but I picked it up at closing time so I will have to wait until Monday.

Bad fuel may amplify the problem but it isn't the root cause. Not happy at all going to ring Subaru first thing Monday and I won't rest until this is fixed or they replace the vehicle. At this point it is dangerous to drive, can't rely on the car to have power when you need it.

To be honest at this point I don't think they will ever fix it properly, these cars are lemons.

[ahum]

After calling Subaru to complain they must have contacted the dealer to get me to take the car back in again. I was given the impression they just wanted the vehicle to run some tests and report back to Subaru. Left the vehicle with them all day last Thursday and when I got a call to pick up the vehicle I was surprised when they said they had fixed the issue and I quote 'it was like a new car to drive'. Well it was like a new car to drive and things looked good..... for about 12 hours and now it is back to its old tricks. Just writing a lengthy complaint letter to send to Subaru now.

[steptoe]

I wonder if a small bottle LPG assist system was installed on these troubld Foresters whether it would fix them as it seems to be a pollution issue this shudder, the LPG mix assisting Diesel supposedly results in a cleaner burn , think DPF issues, oil dilution rates etc. Guess no one is gonna find out without a spend ?

[Subyroo]

Edit: Just spoke to the dealer about getting a loan car and asked why they wanted to change the glow plugs. Short answer is they don't but need to remove them to get at the real problem and wanted spares in stock in case the got broken (apparently they are a pain in the ass to remove).

You would expect this type of problem to also arise during testing of the prototypes and modifications made before release, is Subaru quality control slipping down the gurgler?

[thunder039]

You would expect this type of problem to also arise during testing of the prototypes and modifications made before release, is Subaru quality control slipping down the gurgler?

i wonder if its also just australia that is having the problems

[TOONGA]

We have a 2010 TD forester and it has never had the shudder of unhappyness. mind you from the outset my wife has driven long distances and never used enviro-diesel.

I even asked the dealership in Bunbury about this shudder, they said they have been briefed but have not seen the problem ... ("yet" could I add)

As for the problem in other countries

http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin ... post7.html

from this thread http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin ... tc-110745/

so it could be a problem world wide

TOONGA

[skipalami]

Outback's 62500km service just completed. DPF unburnables at 4%. Was the same at 50000km service as well.

[pitrack_1]

Outback's 62500km service just completed. DPF unburnables at 4%. Was the same at 50000km service as well.

That's encouraging, I'm up for the 62.5k service next, probably near the end of the year. I'll see if I can get a readout too.

[Falco80]

Outback's 62500km service just completed. DPF unburnables at 4%. Was the same at 50000km service as well.

Skipalami, are you calling the soot accumulation ratio "DPF unburnables"? I had my 75000Km service today. The soot accumulation ratio was at 2% (12% last service), but the cumulative ash ratio was at 26% (21% last service). Guess that means my DPF is 26% blocked.

[greydiesel]

Going uphill, in a high gear at the engine's highest torque band and feeling a shudder?

...Thats the clutch slipping.

Answer is above, one member replaces stock subie clutch with heavy duty Exedy and fixes problem.

[eems]

Just to follow up on this thread, i've had the EGR valve blanked off since February and the engine has not made a single shudder in that time.

It's %100 EGR system *related*. Right after blanking the unit, the engine still shuddered in an identical fashion. But, with after an ECU reset, the problem hasn't reappeared.

It's possible a learned function gets disrupted because of the EGR's operation. Just looking at it logically suggests the EGR valve operating causes the ECU to learn parameters which lead to outputs that cause the engine to shudder.

In summary, the car had a shudder problem for 14 months until the EGR was blanked off and the ECU reset. It has been working well for 9 months. DPF still re-generates and the car drives fine. Economy is better.

The engine check light does come on every 1000-1500kms with an intake temp error, which is common when EGR's are deleted. Looking into an electronic fix when i get some time.

[pitrack_1]

That's encouraging, I'm up for the 62.5k service next, probably near the end of the year. I'll see if I can get a readout too.

2010 Forester Diesel 62.5k service ~7 Nov: DPF Ash level readout 24%.

Spoke to the service manager. He didn't know about the ash level readout at first, but he bothered to find out (unlike some others). Willing to talk about other issues, he was most helpful and after my query upon possible eventual replacement due to ash he rang the Subaru Aust engineers to determine when the DPF replacement warning would be tripped.

The answer is DPF ash warning is at 100% ash level. So assuming linearity that gives me 62.5/24*100= ~260k kms before DPF replacement.

He also mentioned several DPFs have been replaced due to petrol being inadvertently added to the tank, they are $$$$ so be careful refueling!

[El_Freddo]

Just to follow up on this thread, i've had the EGR valve blanked off since February and the engine has not made a single shudder in that time.

What has the subaru service department had to say about doing this and your warranty?

Just curious.

Cheers

Bennie

[Subyroo]

2010 Forester Diesel 62.5k service ~7 Nov: DPF Ash level readout 24%.

Spoke to the service manager. He didn't know about the ash level readout at first, but he bothered to find out (unlike some others). Willing to talk about other issues, he was most helpful and after my query upon possible eventual replacement due to ash he rang the Subaru Aust engineers to determine when the DPF replacement warning would be tripped.

The answer is DPF ash warning is at 100% ash level. So assuming linearity that gives me 62.5/24*100= ~260k kms before DPF replacement.

He also mentioned several DPFs have been replaced due to petrol being inadvertently added to the tank, they are $$$$ so be careful refueling!

I was reading about the Mazda C5 Diesel and it's problems last night, looks like Subaru are not alone with diesel issues.